Volume 10 Number 39
                       Produced: Wed Dec  1 19:01:52 1993

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

         [Jack A. Abramoff]
Archiving  and Searching Mail-Jewish
         [Robert Israel]
Ashkenazi & Sephardi Sifrei Torah
         [Malcolm Isaacs]
Intermarriage Discussion
         [Motty Hasofer]
Jonathan Pollard (2)
         [David Charlap, Yisrael Medad]
         [Anthony Fiorino]
Religious Zionism vs. Love of Zion
         [Jamie Leiba]
Yaakov (V10 #12)
         [Neil Parks]


From: Jack A. Abramoff <71544.2433@...>
Date: 30 Nov 93 13:03:57 EST
Subject: Re: Amalek

In volume 10, number 33 Jonathan Goldstein writes:

>I have been tuaght that the Nazis are to be equated with Amalek.  If that
is the case, is it not preferealbe for clandestine Nazi organisers to
quietly disappear, rather than be placed in a jail from where they can
still run their organisation?

While it would be great for the current band of neo and pseudo Nazis to
disappear, we should remember that the mitvzah to wipe out Amalek only
applies when we are settled in our land.  Most poskim would not hold
that we are "settled" in our land, so even if it could be shown that the
Nazis are Amalek, making them disappear might be problematic, at least
halachically.  What is very interesting, of course, is the degree to
which the WWII Nazis actually considered themselves the direct
descendants of the Amaleikim; Julius Streicher's comment about Purim at
his hanging provides just one example.  Also related is the extent the
Nazis went to capture Biblical objects and symbols.  "Raiders of the
Lost Ark" being based on the SS's actual plans and desires to find the
aron; Hitler's capture of the Spear of Destiny (important in the xtian
scriptures) is also related.  These were truly sick gangsters who saw
themselves as Amalek and, as such, with the mission to wipe us off the
face of the earth.

Jack Abramoff


From: Robert Israel <israel@...>
Date: Tue, 30 Nov 93 01:53:36 -0500
Subject: Archiving  and Searching Mail-Jewish

Mark Katz asked for "a key-word search facility to be able to locate
individual newsletters or even articles."  The Listserver already
has a search function, which you can access by e-mail.  For example, to test 
the system out I just sent a message to <listserver@...>, no subject, 

body of message
   search mail-jewish -all "turkey"

and 14 minutes later I received a reply containing all the lines in all
the articles that mentioned "turkey" (or "Turkey").

For more information on listproc commands, you can send  
<listserver@...> the message 

or for more information on searching,
    help search  

Robert Israel                            <israel@...>
Department of Mathematics             
University of British Columbia
Vancouver, BC, Canada V6T 1Y4

[Seth Ness also sent in a response about the search facility of the
listserv. The output you get back identifies the file it found the word
in, so you can then use the get command to get the relavent files if you
wish. Mod]


From: <M.Isaacs@...> (Malcolm Isaacs)
Date: Tue, 30 Nov 93 12:48:12 -0500
Subject: Ashkenazi & Sephardi Sifrei Torah

Can anyone give me specific details of the differences in text between
the Ashkenazi and Sephardi Sifrei Torah?  I believe that there are a
small number of differences (malei/chaser etc) between them.


From: Motty Hasofer <mottyh@...>
Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1993 20:46:57 +1100 (EST)
Subject: Re: Intermarriage Discussion

Below is the information regarding a new discussion list.

 Welcome to "Inter". The aim of this moderated discussion list is to
 discuss and canvass ideas, activities, programs and suggestions regarding
 Intermarriage. This list is for serious discussion to try to understand
 the issues and discuss ways of reducing intermarriage.

 It must be assumed that a Jew marrying a non-Jew is not a situation to be
 encouraged within this list.
 Intermarriage is arguably the most serious problem facing the Jewish
 people today and many communities are dealing with the myriad issues which
 this situation presents.
 This list is NOT for general "schmoozing" on all Jewish topics, it is
 exclusively for discussion on Intermarriage and closely related subjects
 such as Jewish singles. 
 Any ideas which can help reduce intermarriage, empower people to discuss
 the issues with others, engender further discussion etc. are fair game.

To subscribe to "inter", mail to


with message:

sub inter (your name)
 To unsubscribe from "inter", mail to:
 with the message:
 unsubscribe yourname
 Any queries should be sent to the moderator at:
 Motty Hasofer
 Jewish Singles Services.  Working Group On Intermarriage.
 159 Orrong Rd. East St. Kilda Victoria Australia.
 Phone 61-3-5282216  Fax 61-3-5238235.


From: <dic5340@...> (David Charlap)
Date: Tue, 30 Nov 93 12:20:31 -0500
Subject: Jonathan Pollard

J.Leci <te2005@...> writes:

>Jonathan has now been held longer than many other spies who
>spied on the US for friendly countries. An Egyptian who spied on the
>USA for Iraq was imprisoned for only three years.

As one who does not support your efforts, let me explain a little more.
All these other people accused of spying (who got off with light
sentances) were not citizens of the USA.  When a foreign citizen spies,
it is espionage.  When an American deliberately violates his security
clearance and gives secrets away, it is treason and not espionage.

Jonathan Pollard was not some foreign agent infiltrating an American
military organization.  He was an officer who swore oaths and signed
documents stating that he would safeguard the state secrets that he had
access to.  He violated those oaths and contracts.

This is very very different from the Egyptian you speak of.

I strongly object to the fact that Jewish organizations think high
treason is defensible simply because the information went to Israel.
Judaism has never condoned criminal actions, and it should not start

From: MEDAD%<ILNCRD@...> (Yisrael Medad)
Date: Tue, 30 Nov 93 12:47:54 -0500
Subject: Jonathan Pollard

Yishar Koach (All power to you) on the Pollard posting.  I visited him
on Oct. 25 in Butner, NC - in my position as the Knesset Coordinator of
the Pollard Caucus.  He still cannot receive properly any Kosher meals;
the local Jewish chaplin from Raleigh is not that happy to be with him
and weekly prayer sevices on Friday are conducted in English - no
Hebrew; the prison chaplin is an Imman (for all the Black Muslims) with
a Free Palestine poster in his office.  Over 25 of the most outstanding
Rabbis, Rashei Yeshivot and Morei Halacha recently published a call to
work on Jay's behalf.  I urge you all to do the most.  Oh, he wears a
kippah seruga (Israeli style knitted yarmulke) all day and is one of
only four Jews there.

Yisrael Medad


From: Anthony Fiorino <fiorino@...>
Date: Tue, 30 Nov 93 13:14:16 -0500
Subject: Locusts

A while back, there was a discussion regarding eating locusts if one was
in a place where the community retained the masora regarding which kinds
are kosher.  I didn't recall any conclusion to the discussion, but I
recently came across some relevant information in _The Laws of Kashrus_
by R. B. Forst.

The darchei teshuva notes that one may eat locusts if one finds
him/herself in a community which possesses such a masorah , even if one
plans to return to his/her own community.  This follows a similar din
regarding the eating of birds such as quail and pheasant (shulchan
aruch, yoreh deah 82:4).  The Shach comments that this case is different
from the normal rule that one is bound by his/her tradition because the
not eating of these fowl is not due to a tradition of not eating them,
but rather is due to the absence of any tradition allowing one to eat

Eitan Fiorino


From: Jamie Leiba <leiba@...>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1993 11:16:00 +0000 
Subject: re: Religious Zionism vs. Love of Zion 

My friend asked me to post this reponse on his behalf to Morris Podolak's 

Morris Podolak said,

> I would just like to point out, for those on the net who are not 
> familiar with the literature, that the above quote is NOT a          
> translation of the Gemara, but rather an interpretation, and not to
> be seen as more than that.

I'll quote the Gemara directly (Kesubos 110b - at the very bottom),
translating as literally as possible.

"Rabbi Yehuda says: any one who goes up from Babylonia to Eretz Yisroel,
transgresses a positive commandment, as it says 'To Babylonia they will
be brought, and there they will be until the day I redeem them, says the

Tosafos there ("Bavela") says: "Even though this verse is speaking about
the first exile, there is to say that the Torah forbids (aliya) even
from the second exile."

A previous Tosafos (110b "Hu omar...") adds: "Says Rabbeinu Chaim: 'now
there is no mitzva to live in Eretz Yisroel.'"  ...Notice the word "to
live" (l'dor) - nothing specific about aliya, but living in general...
I'm not sure where the interpretation lies - it all seems pretty
straightforward to me.

And as to R' Moshe Feinstein

> Rav Moshe talked about the obligation to make aliya, not about  
> those who already live in Israel.

I'll quote that also (Igros Moshe, Even Hoezer 1, 102 - at the end of
the tshuva) "And in the matter of which you asked, whether there is a
mitzva to live (l'dor) in Eretz Yisroel...there is no mitzva today..."
Again, no distinction between aliya and those who already live in


From: <neil.parks@...> (Neil Parks)
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 93 23:59:00 -0500
Subject: Yaakov (V10 #12)

  > Date: Wed, 17 Nov 93 11:26:41 -0500
  > From: <zisblatt@...> (Sam Zisblatt)
  > Subject: Yakov
  >  Uri Meth recently included in a posting that each of the AVOS (fathers)
  > had a special quality, and that Yakov's was Emes (honesty).  But it was
  > only this past week that we read in Parshas Toldos about Yakov deceiving
  > his father to get the Blessing of the Bechor (First born).  Any thoughts?

Yaakov bought the birthright from Eysov.  Therefore the blessing was
rightfully his.  When Yitzchok learned that he had given the blessing to
Yaakov, he said, "I blessed him, and he will remain blessed."

Quote from "The Family Chumash/Bereishis", translated and annotated by
Rabbi Meir Zlotowitz, on Genesis 27:33:

" 'Indeed, he shall remain blessed.'  Isaac thus confirmed his blessing.
Lest one think that Jacob would not have been blessed had not engaged in
deception, Isaac confirmed it, blessing him now of his own free will
(Midrash; Rashi)."

On verse 14, Zlotowitz cites a source called "HaKsav V'HaKaballah" to
the effect that Jacob participated in his mother's plan only with great


End of Volume 10 Issue 39