Volume 13 Number 35
                       Produced: Tue May 31 19:00:45 1994

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Camps and traveling in the midbar
         [Gedalyah Berger]
Cholov Yisroel
         [Bruce Krulwich]
Codes and belief
         [Mike Gerver]
fossils revisited
         ["Yitzchok Adlerstein"]
Halacha Yomis, Mishna Yomis
         [Ed Bruckstein]
Hevel Va-rik in Alenu Prayer
         [Rabbi Freundel]
Internet Access
         [David A. Harris]
Kohens & Medicine
         [Stephen Phillips]
Misheberachs for non-Jews
         ["Freda B. Birnbaum"]
Non-Jewish Legal Holidays
         [Sam Juni]
Sefer Haftarot
         [Joey Mosseri]
Sim Sholom
         [Percy Mett]


From: Gedalyah Berger <gberger@...>
Date: Sun, 29 May 1994 11:06:05 -0400
Subject: Camps and traveling in the midbar

> From: Arthur J Einhorn <0017801@...>
> I have a question on parshas bamidbar. Posuk 3 parek 2 and subsequent
> posukim discuss the location of the tribes as they camped and
> travelled. Yehuda is to the East relative to the mishkan and also
> travelled first. This seems paradoxical. Since if they were on the East
> of the mishkan they would be last when travelling west as they did (see
> map in Kaplan version).  Aharon Einhorn

The description in the Torah of the setup of the tribal camps refer to 
just that - the camps.  When benei Yisra'el travelled, they did not 
travel in that configuration but in a straight line, one tribe after 
another, in the order described, with Yehuda first.  When they stopped, 
they rearranged and camped around the mishkan.

Gedalyah Berger
Yeshiva College graduate (as of Thursday) / RIETS


From: Bruce Krulwich <krulwich@...>
Date: Thu, 26 May 1994 14:36:44 -0400
Subject: Cholov Yisroel

Regarding a Rav who said that Cholov Yisroel food could not be eaten if cooked
in Chalav Stam (aka Cholov haCompanies) pots, our moderator said:

> [As a precaution, I checked with Claire to see if the Rabbi was a Lubavitch
> Rabbi, ... She has clarified that this was NOT a Lubavitch Rabbi. If one
> accepts Rav Moshe's psak permitting what is commenly called "cholov stam",
> ...I do not understand the opinion brought above.

It's not just Lubovitch, it's any Chassidim or others (Sefardim?) who do
not accept R' Moshe's psak.  Remember, without R' Moshe's psak, Cholov
Stam is in the category of Cholov Akum [non-Jewish milk], which is
outright prohibited, and which I gather renders pots treif.  (Boy is it
tempting to make an analogy to non-Glatt meat, but I'll refrain.  (:-)



From: <GERVER@...> (Mike Gerver)
Date: Thu, 26 May 1994 4:23:14 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Codes and belief

In v12n96, David Green says that it is dangerous to use the "codes" to
mekarev people (bring them closer to Torah observance), because their
beliefs could then potentially be disproved. I agree with him that the
"codes" are weak thing to base one's belief on, because, with the
present state of our knowledge, it is quite possible that many of the
claims about them will be disproved in the near future. This is a
practical problem.

But David's posting seems to imply that one shouldn't base one's belief
on anything that could be disproved. That seems to me to be even worse
than basing one's belief on the codes. What does it mean to say you
believe something, if it cannot even in principle be disproved? (Sam
Juni also makes this point at the end of his posting in v12n99.)

Mike Gerver, <gerver@...>


From: "Yitzchok Adlerstein" <ny000594@...>
Date: Thu, 26 May 94 23:52:56 -0800
Subject: fossils revisited

I didn't seriously intend to leave Dr. Sam Juni with any feelings
of guilt for misattributing to me a notion I actually detest - that
Hashem laced the world of paleohistory with misleading clues (i.e.
fossils) to test our emunah.  I nonetheless accept, together with
my worn stomach linings, his gracious apologies. 

What won't go down as easily is Dr. Juni's suggestion (or am I now
misattributing what was actually contributed by my dear friend Rav
Shaya Karlinsky?) that at least the opinion of R' Yosi HaGlili
(Sanhedrin 90A) supports the idea of Divine Mischief.  (The gemara
there offers two opinions concerning the false prophet of Devarim
13:2.  R' Yosi HaGlili opines that the Torah instructs us in the
parsha of rejecting the false prophet by warning us that even if a
miracle worker should miraculously still the sun in its place in
the heavens, we should not obey him if he urges idolaty upon us. 
R' Akiva dissents.  "Chas v'shalom that Hashem would stand the sun
[miraculously] for those who contravene His Will."  Dr. Juni makes
the point that at least the first opinion seems to maintain that
Hashem will perform miracles in order to test the tenacity and
emunah of the Jewish people.)

Before concluding that R' Yosi HaGlili held such a view, I would
urge the reader to check with Abarbanel.  His understanding of
several Rishonim is that the success of the false prophet comes
through magic, not a Divine scam.  Furthermore, Malbim's paraphrase
of Abarbanel is also significant: "This is quite improbable, that
Hashem should perform a miracle for a false prophet...Rather, 
Torah employs hyperbole.   Even if the "prophet" WERE to perform a
miracle in the heavens, do not listen to him.  It is impossible
that HKB"H should agree to have you worship idolatry, even for the


From: Ed Bruckstein <bruckstn@...>
Date: Fri, 27 May 1994 08:45:09 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Halacha Yomis, Mishna Yomis

Is anyone aware of where I could get information (i.e., calendar) about 
Halacha Yomis and Mishna Yomis.

I believe there is a Halacha Yomis following the Kitzur Shulchan Orech as 
well as one that follows the Mechaber.

Any information about these "Yomi" programs (other than Daf Yomi and 
Rambam Yomi with which I am familiar) would be appreciated

Good Shabbos.


From: <Dialectic@...> (Rabbi Freundel)
Date: Tue, 31 May 1994 17:13:19 -0400
Subject: Re: Hevel Va-rik in Alenu Prayer

Marc Shapiro writes

"In response to Rabbi Freundel. Jews in the middle ages believed that
hevel va-rik referred to Jesus. There is no evidence whatsoever that
they took this from apostates. In fact, I am not aware of any attacks on
Jews for this until the late middle ages, long after the Haside Ashkenaz
had written about hevel va-rik referring to Jesus."

There is lots in here that I didnt say. (e.g. what apostates??) My only
point was that the association of hevel varik with jesus is late in
jewish sources.  What source does Marc have with the association made
from the chasside ashkenaz I cant find anything earlier than the 17-18th


From: <daharris@...> (David A. Harris)
Date: Thu, 26 May 1994 00:30:10 -0400
Subject: Internet Access

Not long ago, Michael Lipkin posted a message here about gaining
Internet access through the International Internet Association.
If my memory serves, the IIA was discovered to be a scam here in
Washington. Apparently they made it a practice to ask for people's
credit card numbers, "for identification purposes only." Then
no Internet help would follow, but the people would notice charges
on their credit cards. 

I mailed Michael about this separately, but we both agreed that
all who saw his posting should see this warning. It's of course
a wise idea to never give out a credit card number for something
like this, but something tells me it's easier to let one's guard
down when a reward like Internet access is offered. At any rate,
please be careful! And my suggestion is to stay away from the
International Internet Association.  Shalom--

David Harris


From: Stephen Phillips <stephenp@...>
Date: Fri, 27 May 1994 01:02:05 -0400
Subject: Re: Kohens & Medicine

> From: Adam Aptowitzer <aaptowit@...>
> Some friends and I were recently discussing going into medicine
> like every Jewish Mother would like. A big problem is constituted
> by the fact that one of us is a Cohen. We were wondering if
> anyone could help us find sources for halachic information  and
> guidance for a young anxious Jewish student in the 1990's.

I'm sure I read a Teshuvah in Igros Moshe (by Reb Moshe Feinstein
z'tzl) to the effect that there is no Mitzvah to become a doctor,
whereas it is forbidden for a Cohen to come in contact with a dead
body. Accordingly, Reb Moshe did not allow a Cohen to study medicine.

Stephen Phillips


From: "Freda B. Birnbaum" <FBBIRNBAUM@...>
Date: Mon, 30 May 1994 12:47:09 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Misheberachs for non-Jews

Since the last query that I sent to BALTUVA and MAIL-JEWISH and later to
ASK yielded productive results from all three lists (I will summarize
soon; perhaps I will combine that with responses to this one since they
are somewhat related), I'm going to post this to all three lists also. I
would like to know:

May we say a misheberach for a non-Jew and under what circumstances?
(Sources?)  Once one has ascertained that one may, what would be the
preferred way in which to refer to the non-Jew?  (Sources?)  For
example, one could use the English name only, the English name followed
by ben Noach or ben Chava, translate the English name into Hebrew....

I do recall once asking the gabbai to make a misheberach for someone
"ben Noach" and he did.

Freda Birnbaum, <fbbirnbaum@...>


From: Sam Juni <JUNI@...>
Date: Tue, 31 May 1994 09:52:26 -0400
Subject: Non-Jewish Legal Holidays

      I wonder why it is legitimate for Government Offices to have
official holidays for Christmas.  Isn't this a case of state-sponsored
religiosity?  In addition, it seems discriminatory since there are no
parallel days off for other religions.
      How does one get the liberal legal mechinary  involved in this
matter?  Does anyone know of precedents?

     Dr. Sam Juni                  Fax (718) 338-6774
     New York University           Tel (212) 998-5548
     400 East
     New York, N.Y.  10003


From: <JMOSSERI@...> (Joey Mosseri)
Date: Wed, 25 May 1994 22:30:38 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Sefer Haftarot

There seems to be a bit of discussion on this subject and I didn't notice
anyone who quoted Rabbi Obadyah Yosef on this.
In Yehaveh Da'at volume 5 responsa 26 he is asked :
"Is it better to read the Haftarah from a complete printed TANA"KH or is
better to read it from a Sefer Haftarot written by a scribe on Qelaf
(parchment), in which all the haftarot of the year have been gathered?"
In short his answer was:
"It is a missvah to beautify the missvah and to read from a hand written
Sefer Haftarot even though it is only a compilation of haftarot and not a
complete book of Prophets. And if such isn't available then you should read
from a complete printed text of the prophets. And only as a last resort
should you read from the Houmash itself where the haftarah is printed
afterwards and the entire words of the Nebiim are missing"

Does this clarify the issue at all??

Joey Mosseri


From: <P.Mett@...> (Percy Mett)
Date: Thu, 26 May 1994 07:36:02 -0400
Subject: Sim Sholom

Danny Wildman writes:

DW> The Nusach Sefarad custom follows a very simple rule: Sim Shalom is said
DW> in all tfilot chiyuv (obligatory prayers) while Shalom Rav is said with
DW> tfilot r'shut ([once] non-obligatory prayers).  I don't know why this
DW> correspondence should be true. (Perhaps Chazal wanted to shorten the
DW> recitation for those people, in the old days, who "bothered" to say the
DW> non-obligatory Ma'ariv. :-) )
DW> I have the feeling there's some greater "lamdus" behind these customs.
DW> Any further ideas?

The Nusach Sfard custom is to say Sim Sholom at **all** tfilos, without
exception. You can check on this in any authoritative Sfard Sidur (and
Rabbi Yaacov Emden supports this in his Sidur)

However the original Nusach sfard sidurim in Eastern europe were frequently
printed by printers who merely adapted their existing Nusach Ashkenaz
sidur. Thus Sholom Rov was left in the sidur. Since it is clearly not said
at Shaharith and Mincha (the Shatz doesn't say it - he says Sim Sholom) it
was assumed that Sholom Rov is said at Maariv (the only remaining tfila).
There is no basis in the sources for a distinctive Brocho to be said during
Maariv (i.e. it is the same brocho as a normal Mincha)

Perets Mett


End of Volume 13 Issue 35