Volume 14 Number 11
                       Produced: Mon Jul 11 18:53:28 1994

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Academic Research
         [Jeffrey Woolf]
Administrivia - Mazal Tov and Request for Assistance
         [Mitch Berger]
Bodek insect-removal process
         [Chaim Schild]
Conversion Celebration
         [David olesker]
General Kashrus Info
         [Josh Rapps]
High School Tuitions
         [Susan Slusky]
Ichud HaRabbanim
         [Yosef Bechhofer]
Magnetic Cooking.
         [Michael Lipkin]
Ocean Spray products
         [Aliza Klein]
         [Gedalyah Berger]
R. Tauber
         [Yechezkal-Shimon Gutfreund]
Tzedaka and Yeshiva Tuition
         [Frank Silbermann]
What year is it?
         [David Curwin]


From: Jeffrey Woolf <F12043@...>
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 1994 08:47:39 -0400
Subject: Re: Academic Research

I'm still working on my response to Mr. Press' attack on me. I would,
however like to clarify that I did not aim my remarks at Hayyim
Hendeles. I may disagree with him on alot of things but have always
found his postings respectful and well reasoned....Yosher Koach to
Gedalya Berger (chip off the old block) for his comments. I'd just like
to add that while Machon Yerushalayim has done good work, it still:

1) Censors texts by Gedolim which are not 'acceptable' to Aguda/Haredi
2) Cites scholars who are not frumm without giving them credit 
3) Can be very sloppy is its editions (eg Sefer Shibbolei HaLeket Part II).


From: <mberger@...> (Mitch Berger)
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 94 11:16:01 EDT
Subject: Administrivia - Mazal Tov and Request for Assistance

With graditude to the A-lmighty,
And with prayers for strength and sanity, :-) * 0.5
My wife and I would like to announce the birth of our children,
	Baby boy A (TBA) , Shifra Nechamah and Baby boy C (TBA)

All three were due Sept. 25. If you could please say tehillim / mi
shebeirach, or just have good thoughts for them, I'd would GREATLY
appreciate it. Their mother's name is Ya'akovah. (Although my wife goes
by "Siggy".) Although they look pathetic to me, small and sorrounded by
tubes and machinery, the neonatal ICU staff tell me all is going (bli
ayin hara') very well.

People in Northern NJ, we need looking for blood donors, type B+. It
seems adult blood holds oxygen better than the stuff their marrow
produces. If you can help, give me a call ('phone number is in .sig).

[Let me be the first to wish Mazal Tov to our fellow mail-jewish member,
Mitch, Siggy and the children. As I think of mail-jewish as part of my
extended family, I pray that goes well with the children, and if some
fellow "family" members are able to donate blood for Mitch's new
children, drop me an email message, if you get a chance - but call
Mitch, not me. Mod.]

Micha Berger          Ron Arad, Zechariah Baumel, Zvi Feldman, Yehudah Katz:
<mberger@...>  May the Omnipresent have mercy on them and take them from
(212) 464-6565      restraint to openness, from dark to light, from slavery
(201) 916-0287      to salvation.


From: SCHILD%<GAIA@...> (Chaim Schild)
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 1994 09:40:03 -0400
Subject: Bodek insect-removal process

I remember seeing a magazine article in the past few years describing
the Bodek insect-removal process but I can not remember where. Could
someone please tell me ? (It had an in detail description of the use of
the water hoses)



From: David olesker <olesker@...>
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 1994 11:12:43 -0400
Subject: Re: Conversion Celebration

> From: <msl@...> (Michael Lipkin)
> I have a friend who about to complete his conversion process.
> to know if it's appropriate to have some type of celebration 

When I was misgaiyer I asked my Rosh Yeshivah what would be an
appropriate thing to do. He said that in the days of the Bais HaMikdash,
a ger brought a special corbon, and since our prayers take the place of
corbonos, I should go to the kossel, and make sure that I was the tenth
man in a minyan. He showed considerable insight in sugesting this. After
I came bck from the mikvah, I walked to the kossel with nine friends,
and felt the significance of my sudden change in status.

I also organized a small suedas mitzvah with a few friends, only to
discover that a whole group of my friends in the yeshivah, and some of
the Rabbonim, had organized one for me!

David Olesker <olesker@...>


From: <jr@...> (Josh Rapps)
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 94 14:21 EDT
Subject: General Kashrus Info

The following number may be useful in finding out info on who provides
the hashgacha behind 'k' symbols on products. You can call a govt.
kashrus organization that has info on these products at 1-718-722-2852.
I say that it may be useful because it implies that you are familiar
with the various hashgacha services and their levels of reliability.

-josh rapps


From: <segs@...> (Susan Slusky)
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 94 14:58:27 EDT
Subject: High School Tuitions

Gershon Schlussel <76220.3107@...> writes:

>I think that most yeshivos (elem. & high schools) set tuition charges
>somewhere between $4,000 and $8,000 per child. 

Would that it were so! Having recently received tuition bills from
the two NY/NJ yeshiva high schools my children attend I can dolefully tell
you that their tuitions are both around the breathtaking $9400 mark.
(not including the bus)

>It is no wonder that a
>large percentage of the parent body of most yeshivos cannot afford to pay
>full tuition charges. It is for this reason that many parents apply for
>tuition assistance from their children's yeshivos.

No argument here.

Susan Slusky


From: <YOSEF_BECHHOFER@...> (Yosef Bechhofer)
Date: Fri, 8 Jul 1994 13:43:16 -0400
Subject: Ichud HaRabbanim

Well, I  feel that since Avi allowed the statement by Rabbis Shapiro,
Yisraeli and Nria shlita out on MJ, this topic is fair game. I admit
to being very disoriented as to the Religious Zionist perspective on
the Peace Process. For that matter, I am disoriented as to the
Non-Zionist Religious perspective as well!

It is very fine to criticze this government, I certainly have no
sympathy with their ideology and methodology, but I am at a loss to
see a coherent and comprehensive alternative being presented by their
denigrators. Please explain to me, somebody, does anybody have any
other alternative plan as to what to do with 2,000,000 Arabs? I think
that they, deep, or not so deep down, favor "Transfer" - but that is
simply unfeasable, no Arab State will allow it without a war to force
it upon them. So, what other plan might there viably be?

I'm really, therefore, at a loss as to what to think here, and would
appreciate any clarification.


From: <msl@...> (Michael Lipkin)
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 1994 11:12:47 -0400
Subject: Magnetic Cooking.

The July issue of Consumer Reports has a review of stove tops.  In
addition to the usual gas and electric types, which have been halachikly
discussed to death, they tested a couple of magnetic induction stove
tops.  The article didn't give a complete functional description of how
these things work, but what I did gather is that these stove tops remain
cool, have electronic controls, automatically shut off if they sense
over-heating, and shut off if the pot is removed.

To you engineers out there; in terms that a non-engineer can understand,
how do these things work?  What are the halachik ramifications of using
them to warm on Shabbos?  Do they need a blech?  Would a blech work?
What about cooking on Yom Tov?

The magnetic induction stoves are considerably more expensive than a
basic gas or electric.  It seems that they could be either a dream or a
nightmare for the shomer shabbos individual.



From: Aliza Klein <jacobson@...>
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 1994 09:40:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Ocean Spray products

Ocean Spray products:

I called the OU here in NY to inquire about Ocean Spray in general.
Their response was that Ocean Spray is NOT OU certified and only
products that bear the OU symbol are under OU certification.

I told them about the ad that someone mentioned tha advertised Ocean
Spray products as OU-D (in the Jerusalem Post).  The response of the
woman I spoke to was that the person who saw the ad should fax it to
their office and she'll direct it to the appropriate people: (212) 564 -
9058 Attention: Rivka K.

FYI: The number of the OU in New York is (212) 563 - 4000 (though the
standard answer I've gotten has been: if it has an OU on the package...
if it doesn't...

Does anyone know the kashrus status of Ocean Spray Cranberry Cocktail?
Everyone I've asked says it has an OU on the bottle but I haven't found
it yet.

Aliza Klein


From: Gedalyah Berger <gberger@...>
Date: Fri, 8 Jul 1994 15:23:19 -0400
Subject: Politics

> [Yes, I know this is what I would normally return as a political
> posting. However, as this is a statement of R' Shapira, Yisraeli, and
> Neriyah, I feel it has its place in a Halakhic based mailing list. Mod.]

I **EMPHATICALLY** disagree with this decision.  That a political message
was signed by prominent rabbanim does not make it appropriate for a forum
which explicitly bans such messages.  The post was *completely* out of 
place on our list.

Gedalyah Berger


From: sg04%<kesser@...> (Yechezkal-Shimon Gutfreund)
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 1994 18:19:12 -0400
Subject: R. Tauber

Can anyone provide me with information about a Rabbi Tauber from Monsey,
NY who is involved in kiruv work.

I understand that he has published a book on kiruv but I don't know the

If anyone has information about his publications, segment of the
orthodox community (or hashkafa) that he represents, or other
information I would appreciate it.

Yechezkal-Shimon Gutfreund		 	   <sgutfreund@...> [MIME]
GTE Laboratories, Waltham MA     ftp://ftp.gte.com/pub/circus/home/home.html


From: Frank Silbermann <fs@...>
Date: Fri, 8 Jul 1994 10:04:51 -0400
Subject: Tzedaka and Yeshiva Tuition

David Griboff (Vol14 #1) suggests that paying Tzedaka while accepting
day-school scholarships may be motivated by tax considerations --
tzedaka is tax deductible, but tuition is not.

David suggests that this may be ethically improper.  I disagree.  To me
this sounds like an excellent and appropriate strategy, _especially_ if
one can arrange that one's Tzedakah goes to the same school from which
one receives scholarships.

A parent who sends his child to public school may deduct the local taxes
he pays to support public schools, yet he need not declare the value of
the public education his child receives.  Why shouldn't this also be
true of those who support private schools -- especially_since their
taxes are _already_ supporting public schools whose services they do not

Frank Silbermann	<fs@...>
Tulane University	New Orleans, Louisiana  USA


From: <6524dcurw@...> (David Curwin)
Date: Mon, 11 Jul 1994 17:31:42 -0400
Subject: What year is it?

Eric Safern writes:

>I must be missing something.  How could a machlokes about the date of
>*Creation* affect the calculation of the *destruction*?

>For example, if the State was founded 46 years ago, this fact will not
>change - whether the year in question was 5705 after Creation, or 5707,
>the event still took place 46 years ago, didn't it?

Here is how I would explain it: Let's say Group A says the world was
created in year 0, Event X happened in the 1000 years later, and we are
now in the year 2000. Group B disagrees. They say the world was created
2 years before (in the year -2). But they agree that it is currently the
year 2000. So Group B would say that Event X happened 1002 years ago,
while Group A would say that it happened 1000 years ago.

So unlike the example of the establishment of the state (where we count
years from now back to then), the calculation of the destruction is
based on a disagreement of how long the destruction occured after

I hope that's clear (even I am a little confused!)


End of Volume 14 Issue 11