Volume 18 Number 09
                       Produced: Tue Jan 24  6:32:58 1995

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

'premeditated' desire
         [David Kramer]
A Cohen cannot marry (2)
         [Jeremy Nussbaum, Michael J Broyde]
         [Anya Finegold]
Kohen Marriage (v18n6)
         [Yosef Bechhofer]
Kohen marrying a divorcee
         [Gedaliah Friedenberg]
Kosher rennet
         [Rachel Rosencrantz]
Kosher rennet?
         [Eric William Burger]
Magnets on Shabbat
         [Orin D. Golubtchik]
Tallit, and Making a Bracha on it
         [Ben Yudkin]
Talmudic recipes
         [Eli Turkel]
Ways of the goyim
         [Moshe Waldoks]


From: David Kramer <davidk@...>
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 08:19:26 -0700 (IST)
Subject: 'premeditated' desire

In Vol.18 #5 Jerrold Landau claims:

> In halacha, is is considered much worse to do an avera (sin) out of
> premeditation than out of a concession to desire.

Apocryphal anectodes aside - 
What is your source for this distinction?
What is the source for saying it is worse than doing a sin that has a 
punishment of 'Karais'?

[ David H. Kramer                     |  E-MAIL: <davidk@...>   ]
[ Motorola Communications Israel Ltd. |  Phone: (972-3) 565-8638  Fax: 9507 ]


From: <jeremy@...> (Jeremy Nussbaum)
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 9:14:43 EST
Subject: Re: A Cohen cannot marry

> >From: <Gevaryahu@...> (Gilad J. Gevaryahu)
> If you follow R. Feinstein's ruling that C/R marriages can be annulled,
> you certainly have a risk that halachicly these women might be
> considered prostitutes, and will not be allowed to Cohanim. 
> .... It is conceivable that R. Feinstein's ruling solved some mamzerim
> problems but created a different problem, and one can see why
> R. Henkin rejected his view on this issue.

This viewpoint is not unreasonable.  However, it is not accepted as
halacha.  Wrt intercourse outside of marriage, only intercourse with
someone you would not be allowed to marry anyway disqualifies a woman
from marrying a kohen.  [See posting by R. Broyde for sources. Mod]

Again, wrt R. Feinstein's ruling, I believe the intent is that such a
principle can be used when necessary and appropriate, but is not intended
to be used all the time.  In other words, when it is necessary to delve
into the details of the validity of a C/R marriage, in the absence of
other case specific details it can be relied on that there is sufficient
probablity of a problem with the validity of the marriage so that
 ...   However, in the absence of a need to delve into it, the validity
is not questioned.

Jeremy Nussbaum (<jeremy@...>)

From: Michael J Broyde <relmb@...>
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 10:24:35 -0500 (EST)
Subject: A Cohen cannot marry

One of the writers stated that a woman who was a prostitute may not
marry a chohen, and continued this by remarking that any person who has
had sexual relations prohibited by halacha may not marry a cohen.
	This is clearly false and is rejected by halacha.  Mechaber
states in Even Haezer 6:8 that even a women who freely had sexual
relations with any Jew who was interested may marry a cohen; while
perhaps the beit shmuel argues in some form, the normative halacha is
that a woman is only prohibited to marry a cohen (based on illicit
sexual relations) if she had sexual relations with either (1) a Gentile;
(2) one who cannot marry her (brother, father) (3) when she was married
to another comitted adultery.
	Of course, in the modern world, a woman who was actually a
prostitute, (ie, had sex with anyone who would pay her), would with
almost certainly have had sexual relations with a Gentile, and thus
could not marry a cohein.

Michael Broyde


From: <ae_fine@...> (Anya Finegold)
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 12:01:14 -0500
Subject: Cholim/Sheymos

About a week ago someone posted names of Cholim for whom Tefilos could
be said.  There is a list where you can get or receive names of Cholim.
To subscribe to it send the message sub bikur your full name to

I was also wondering if hardcopies of mj digests were Sheymos and could not
be thrown out with regular garbage.

Anya Finegold 


From: <sbechhof@...> (Yosef Bechhofer)
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 08:50:11 -0600 (CST)
Subject: Re: Kohen Marriage (v18n6)

I assume others will write in as well, but the greater volume the better
on this to prevent any misconceptiom. IT IS ABSOLUTELY FALSE TO SAY THAT
[I've cut out the rest of the reply which is similar to R. Broyde's and
as he included the sources, I'm using him. But I wanted to present the
range of the volume. Mod.]

Yosef Gavriel Bechhofer


From: Gedaliah Friedenberg <gedaliah@...>
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 10:13:26 -0500
Subject: Kohen marrying a divorcee

I asked my Rosh HaYeshiva, HaRav Osher Zelig Friedman (not only a
talmid chacham and rosh yeshiva, but an allergist as well!).  

He told me that a non-frum Kohen who marries a divorcee (or any woman
forbidden to him), and they become frum (ba'alei teshuva), there is no
avenue for them to continue their marriage.



From: <rachelr@...> (Rachel Rosencrantz)
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 09:13:03 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Kosher rennet

> >From: Chana Ackerman <meru1@...>
> I was told by someone that rennet is so far chemically from the actual
> stomach of a calf that the rule doesn't hold, but if that's the case,
> why do we require Kosher rennet?  It seems to me that if it's so far
> from the actual calf stomach that it isn't really calf stomach, or even
> meat, it's just another neutral food additive, like agar, or carob bean
> gum, why does it require a Hechsher (Leaving Cholov Isroel out of it for
> the moment)?

I can't answer the quesiton about where kosher rennet comes from (if it
isn't vegetable based) but the idea that Rennet is so far chemically
from the actual stomach of a calf that it isn't meat is, I believe, from
the Conservative halacha.  Under the book on Conservative Kosher rennet
in cheese is not considered an issue (I think the argument is a
combination of bitul and that rennet is so chemically removed from
meat).  (This is not to say that all Conservative Jews hold by this.)

If you are actually located in SF there are a few Orthodox Rabbi's in
the area.  (Although I moved out east due to a need for more
Yiddishkeit, so I understand your position.)

There are Chabad Rabbi's in Berkeley (Rabbi Ferris), San Francisco (I
have forgotten the name, I haven't been to that Chabad House), and in
Palo Alto.  (And I believe in Marin as well, but I didn't often travel
that far North.)  Also Rabbi Lipner is the Rabbi of the Hebrew Academy
in San Francisco, and is an Orthodox Rabbi.  (As are the other Rabbi's
at the Hebrew Academy.)  You may want to contact these people in the
mean time.  (And there are 2 Orthodox Shuls in San Jose if you are
further South. Am Echad and Ahavas Torah Rabbi Lapin is the Rabbi of Am


From: <ericb@...> (Eric William Burger)
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 11:29:09 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Kosher rennet?

Forwarded message from Chana Ackerman:
>  From what I read in the Art Scroll guide to Kashruth there seems to be
> such a thing as Kosher rennet (this is derived from the stomach of a
> nursing calf and is used in a heating process to coagulate most
> cheeses).  What I want to know is how we can use such a product since
> the Torah root of all our meat/milk rules is based on the prohibition on
> "seething a calf in the milk of its mother"?  The use of stomach of
> nursing calf in a milk product seems to me to be the most flagrant
> possible violation of that direct Torah prohibition.

It gets worse: rennet is actually a generic term for the enzymes found
in any mammal's stomach.  Much of the rennet in the U.S. is derived from
pig stomachs.

Recently there was an introduction of an extracted enzyme manufactured
using genetic engineering harvesting.  The base material comes from
pig's stomachs.  The "jury" is still out on that one.  Definately
consult your LOR: Some say it's OK, as it's "purified".  Others say it's
NOT, as it's from pigs.

- Eric


From: Orin D. Golubtchik <ogolubtc@...>
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 9:22:10 EST
Subject: Magnets on Shabbat

Does anybody know if there is any halachic prohibition against playing
with/using magnets on Shabbat (eg: magnets on a refrigirator).
Is there an issue of muktzeh ?  or boneh (are you opening/closing a circuit
of some kind?)
Any answers will be appreciated.


From: <oujac@...> (Ben Yudkin)
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 11:59:44 +0000
Subject: Tallit, and Making a Bracha on it

In a recent mailing about whether single men must wear a tallit to have an
aliya, Shimon Schwarz writes:

> Our shul (Cong. Ohab Zedek in NYC) is heavily single.
> The daily morning minyanim (there are three), as well as Shabbat,
> have 70-80% singles (my guesstimate) in the men's section.
> Tallitot are required for aliyot at all times.

I have also never been at a shul where a single man without a tallit did not
put one on for an aliya.  Readers may like to know, however, that a friend of
mine recently told me he had asked about the necessity to make a beracha on a
tallit worn for such a reason.  If worn to fulfil the mitzvah of tzitzit, a
tallit requires a beracha.  If worn for kevod hatzibbur [the public honour],
for example just for an aliya or in order to act as sheliach tzibbur [the
leader of prayer], the situation is slightly more complicated.  My friend's
rabbi said that in such circumstances, one must still make a beracha on one's
own tallit or that of a shul where one is a paid-up member, but not on a
friend's tallit.
* This is not given as a halachically binding opinion, but to make readers
aware that there may be situations in which a beracha should not be made and if
made would be levatalah [in vain], a serious prohibition. CYLOR. *

Ben Yudkin


From: <turkel@...> (Eli Turkel)
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 95 08:44:39 +0200
Subject: Talmudic recipes

       I am not sure about talmudic recipes but there is a restaurant in
the old city of Jerusalem in the cardo that serves Roman style food. The owner
told me that originally they served meals based on ancient Roman recipes
but that this did not go over very well and so they have since added modern
spices etc. for modern tastes. They do offer togas and harp music.



From: <WALDOKS@...> (Moshe Waldoks)
Date: Mon, 23 Jan 1995 14:02:38 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: Ways of the goyim

Why are there so many glatt kosher chinese restaurants filled on Sunday
evenings. Isn't this a custom of gentiles and non-observant Jews of the
last three or four decades. I don't understand why a pious Jew would
object to observing and celebrating a bat-mitzvah while at the same time
sip hot and sour soup and wrap his mu-shu in pancakes that are far from
being latkes. Maybe I missed something? Moshe Waldoks


End of Volume 18 Issue 9