Volume 25 Number 89
                      Produced: Tue Jan 28 20:48:51 1997

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Airline Meals and Mezonot Rolls
         [Michael & Bonnie Rogovin]
Arzie Halivanon
         [Avraham Poupko]
Calculating Parshiyot
         [Jeff Fischer]
         [Carl Singer]
Drawing Conclusions
         [Rafi Stern]
Identity of the Tzemah Tzedek
         [David Glasner]
Kiddush Customs
         [Shimon Lebowitz]
Why The Disparity (Revisited!?)
         [Russell Hendel]


From: Michael & Bonnie Rogovin <rogovin@...>
Date: Sun, 26 Jan 1997 16:13:23 +0000
Subject: Airline Meals and Mezonot Rolls

On a recent airline flight a note was included with our kosher meal,
catered by Wilton Foods (OU).  After noting that the meal was prepared
under OU supervision, the note went on to telling us about the dishes,
utensils, meat, etc. (I guess saying that it is OU supervised isn't good
enough anymore.  Imagine what food packaging would look like:

"These crackers are OU.  The wrapper and box were never used before.  If
the box is unsealed, kashrut cannot be guarenteed..."  Duh.

More significantly was this paragraph: "Bread and rolls are ha-motzee
and pas yisrael. The Orthodox Union requires that all our bread and
rolls be hamotzee because when eating a meal ("kovaya seudah") a person
is required to recite "hamotzee" even on a "mezonos" roll.  If washing
is inconvenient, may we suggest that you save the bread for another

Several questions are raised by this statement: Washing is ALWAYS
inconvenient on an airplane, especially during meal service. If it is to
be assumed that one cannot be reasonably expected to wash, then why
provide the roll or make the main course of a snack meal a deli
sandwich?  Is it not a problem of lifnei iver?


From: <apoupko@...> (Avraham Poupko)
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 1997 12:11:30 +0200
Subject: Arzie Halivanon

> From: <hefter@...> (Hefter Family)
> The term 'arzei levanon' is used in the kinot on tisha b'av to
> introduce the paragraph describing the martyrdom of the 'asara harugei
> malchus'. The question has come up as to the earliest use of this
> phrase/original source of this phrase, used in this context. Any
> insights would be appreciated.

The Kinah starts "Arzie Halevanon, Aderie Hatora"
It is a play on words from Yisha'ayhu Chap 11 V.s 34.
 The word Adir is referring to the noise that the tree makes when
falling, but the poet uses it to mean a person great in tora.That is
based on the verse "Ke'erez Balevanon Yisgeh" (Psalms 92 vs 13)referring
to a zaddik.
   There is a certain sarcastic bitterness intended, because the chapter
in psalms talks about the zaddik reaching old age.
   The beginning of the same chapter asks why evil people do so well.
It could be that that was also part of the reason that this particular
image is used.

Avraham <apoupko@...>


From: <rabbi_gabbai@...> (Jeff Fischer)
Date: Fri, 17 Jan 1997 12:09:21, -0500
Subject: Re: Calculating Parshiyot

There are 3 times when Israel and Chutz La'aretz read different

1.  If the 2nd day of Shavuot falls on Shabbat, then Israel is 1 week
ahead of Chutz La'aretz till The Shabbos of Chukas - Balak.  That week,
Israel will read Balak and Chutz La'aretz reads Chukas - Balak.

2. If the last day of Pesach falls on Shabbos and it was a leap year,
then Israel stays 1 week ahead of Chutz La'aretz until the Shabbos of
Mattos Masei.  That week, Chutz La'aretz reads Mattos Masei and Israel
reads Masei.

3. If the last day of Pesach falls on Shabbos and it was a regular year,
then Israel stays 1 week ahead of Chutz La'aretz until the Shabbos of
Behar - Bechukotai.  That week, Chutz La'aretz reads Behar - Bechukotai
and Israel reads Bechukotai.

#1 applies to common years in which Rosh HaShana falls on a Tuesday,
Pesach falls on a Thursday and it is a regular (354 days) year.  It also
applies to a common year if Rosh HaShana falls on a Monday, Pesach falls
on a Thursday and it is an excessive (355 days) year.

#1 applies to leap years in which Rosh HaShana falls on a Monday, Pesach
falls on a Thursday and it is a defective (383 days) year.  It also
applies to a leap year if Rosh HaShana falls on a Shabbos, Pesach falls
on a Thursday and it is an excessive (385 days) year.

#2 applies to leap years in which Rosh HaShana falls on a Tuesday,
Pesach falls on a Shabbos and it is a regular (384 days) year.  It also
applies to a leap year if Rosh HaShana falls on a Monday, Pesach falls
on a Shabbos and it is an excessive (385 days) year.

#3 applies to common years in which Rosh HaShana falls on a Thursday,
Pesach falls on a Shabbos and it is a regular (354 days) year.

Overall, the general rule is the following:

1.  If it is a common year, then you have the most of the double
parshiyot together, if a leap year, then they are separate.

2.  Parshas Chukas Balak does not depend on a leap year.  If Shavuos
falls on Shabbos in Chutz La'aretz, then they read the 2 Parshiyot
together.  If Shavuot falls on any other day of the week, then the 2 are
read separately.

3.  Parshat Motttos - Masei are always read together in Chutz La'aretz
except when it is a leap year and Pesach (1st day) falls on Sunday.

4.  Parshat Nitzavim Vayelech depends on Rosh HaShana.  If Rosh HaShana
falls on a Monday or Tuesday, then they are read separately.  If Rosh
HaShana falls on a Thursday or Shabbos, then they are read together.

5.  There is 1 other exception that I know of and that is regarding
Vayakhel Pekude.  In addition to it being read separately in Chutz
La'aretz and Eretz Yisroel during a leap year, it is also read
separately on a common year if Pseach falls on a Sunday AND the first
day of Rosh HaShana was a Thursday (excessive year - 385 days).

Hope this helps.

Gabbai at Young Israel of Passaic - Clifton


From: Carl Singer <CARLSINGER@...>
Date: Thu, 9 Jan 97 17:58:01 UT
Subject: RE: Cheese

Cheese -- a question.
(Again, I'm coming in, in the middle of discussions.)  Many years ago (mid 
70's) when my wife was at Michigan State, a graduate student (with Yadin 
Yadin) inspected the model dairy at MSU.  All of the cheeses (including many 
varieties that we don't usually see on kosher shelves) were made from 
artificial rennets.  This doesn't address either supervision, 
commercialization or distribution issues -- but might indicate that a viable 
source could be established.  Also, I'm not fully sure of what "artificial" 
rennet really implies.


From: Rafi Stern <rafistern@...>
Date: 19 Jan 1997 12:11:00 -0000
Subject: Drawing Conclusions

After a very dry winter, it has Baruch HaShem started raining here in
Eretz Yisrael. Everyone in the country is very happy about this and this
is probably the one issue which unites left and right secular and
religious.  However, things are not that simple...

Before I go any further I wish to stress that I *do not* want to start a
political argument here; it is the principle that bothers me and that is
the discussion which I would like to start. I will also state at the
outset that the following may or may not be a reflection of my own
political views and that that is irrelevant.

A friend pointed out to me that it may be a mere coincidence but it
started raining on the night that the Hebron agreement was
finalized. Not only that, someone else later told me, but it all
happened in the week of Parashat Bo where we read about Yetziat
Mitzrayim (the Exodus from Egypt) - a departure from a very bad
situation to much greater things. "A mere coincidence" I say?  Are there
"mere coincidences"? Do we have permission to draw conclusions from such
coincidences? Do we have permission not to?

Personally, I do not believe in drawing too many conclusions from things
like this, as this was I understand, the job of the Prophets and not
something for the rest of us to dabble in. However I am left a bit
uneasy about these coincidences when they are presented as such,
especially seeing as the relationship between rain and our deeds is very
well established and more or less given into our hands by explicit
verses. There is a certain tension between the command to be
straightforward in our dealings with God, and the information that He
gave us that if we misbehave He will mete out on us various
punishments. Are we supposed to look for the reasons for these
punishments or not? And if so, how? This is a wider question.

Rafi Stern
Tel:   (H)972-2-9919162  (W)972-2-6873312 
Email: <rafistern@...>             


From: David Glasner <DGLASNER@...>
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 1997 14:04:55 -0500
Subject: Identity of the Tzemah Tzedek

Eli Clark writes (25:80)

>I came across a teshuvah (responsum) of the Shevut Yaakov (Yoreh Deah,
>siman 74), which invokes the principle of evah in the context of
>internal Jewish relations.  The question involved the right of amei
>ha-aretz (ignorant Jews) to vote on matters of Jewish communal affairs.
>In his answer, the Shevut Yaakov (R. Yaakov Reischer, late 17-early
>18th c., Prague) states that absolute denial of voting rights to amei
>ha-aretz is improper because "vadai ika evah," this would clearly
>result in evah.

>R. Reischer also cites a teshuvah of the Tzemah Tzedek, siman 2 (R.
>Menahem Mendel of Krokhmal), who supports the extension of voting
>rights to amei ha-aretz lest they withdraw from the community.  But the
>Tzemah Tzedek does not use the term evah; instead he cites the Gemara
>in Hagigah, in which R. Yosi rules that we accept the testimony of amei
>ha-aretz, so that they not withdraw from the community.

The attribution of this teshuvah quoted in the Shevut Yaakov to R.
Menahem Mendel (the third Lubavitcher Rebbe) is clearly problematic
since R. Menachem Mendel was born around 1790 and, according to Eli,
the Shevut Yaakov was written in the late seventeenth or early
eighteenth centuries.  

The more likely source for the Shevut Yaakov was the original book of
responsa published under the name Tzemach Tzedek which was published in
the seventeenth century by R. Yom Tov Lipman Heller, nowadays known as
the Tosafot Yom Tov, who as it happens was also from Prague.  But at
least until the nineteenth century the Tosafot Yom Tov was also widely
known not only as the Tosafot Yom Tov, but as the Tzemach Tzedek.
However, the name Tzemach Tzedek has since pretty well become the
exclusive possession of Lubavitch.

Does anyone know of another instance in which the title of a famous work
by an earlier author has been appropriated by a later one?

David Glasner


From: Shimon Lebowitz <shimonl@...>
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 1997 10:00:40 +0200
Subject: Kiddush Customs

Carl Singer <CARLSINGER@...> writes:
> On rare occasion I've had a guest in my home who has made it a point to
> note that their minhag is different than mine and acted accordingly (in
> my case, stood while I sat.)  Does anyone have any comments / sources
> re: this phenomena -- that is NOT doing what your host does.  I don't
> know that it's yotzai mean haklal, but it sure isn't comfortable.

I found this interesting. I always sit (as is MY father's minhag, amu"sh),
but when I have guests at my table, as is b"H often the case (we live 
across the street from a dorm) I make it a point to tell them that if they
are more comfortable standing, to please feel free to! I have never
found that it made me uncomfortable at all. :-)

I also stand during a guests kiddush, if that is his minhag.

It seems to me that minor differences in custom should not be allowed 
to interfere in the pleasure a guest has at ones table, and the pleasure
*I* have in doing hachnasat orchim (hospitality).

Perhaps the difference is in *who* makes the decision. If a guest would
stand without my offering it... would I feel he is imposing? Maybe the
fact that I do offer is what makes it more pleasant for both?  (playing
with a bit of amateur psychology here...) ;-)

<isrmedia@...> (Yisrael Medad)  also wrote:

>  I feel that all should be assembled about the table and not just
> listening from where they happen to be.  Is there any source for this
> that would deflect their anger away from my demands to some gadol:-)?

Our custom of sitting for kiddush alleviates some of this, as the family
do all come to the table. But I understand the 'attention' problem.  I
have recently started to 'get people in the mood' for kiddush, after all
are present, by smiling at each one, and addressing each person by name,
with a 'good shabbos ploni'. With a dozen ppl at the table this can take
an extra minute or so... but I find its worth it :-))

I get each individual's attention (except the baby) before we start the
kiddush itself, and all are (usually) smiling back...

Please pray for my cousin and a friend:
  Aharon Yitzchak ben Devorah Leah - already received self-supplied transplant 
  Chaim Asher Zelig ben Sarah - receiving an incompatible bone marrow
May G-d grant that these procedures succeed, and their lives be spared!! 
Shimon Lebowitz             ----->  Please note NEW email:
Jerusalem, Israel                   mailto:<shimonl@...>
http://www.randomc.com/~shimon/    IBMMAIL: I1060211


From: <rhendel@...> (Russell Hendel)
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 1997 21:21:59 -0500
Subject: Why The Disparity (Revisited!?)

The recent below freezing weather reminded me of a famous MJ posting:
"Why the disparity" which raised the issue of why fellow Jews offered a
ride to a Jewish student waiting in the cold for a bus while by contrast
no Jews with "black hats" offered this student a ride. I suddenly
realized that this question can be applied to ourselves! Consider the
following 3 recent topics of mj discussion in Volume 25:

1) Should Jews donate bone marrow to gentiles
2) Why do Yeshiva students cheat 
3) A woman with terminal cancer started riding to synagogue (because she
was too weak to walk)was ostracized by her community and had her
Kashruth slandered  

There was (and is) significant talk about the bone marrow and cheating
topics.  In both cases we were told that it is a "Chilul Hashem". By
contrast only 3 postings were offered on the terminal cancer patient
desecrating the Sabbath.

Why the disparity?

Isn't it chilul hashem to ostracize and slander a dying person. Is it
less of an embarassment to the Jewish community then say cheating on

Why the disparity?

Russell Jay Hendel, Ph.d, ASA, rhendel @ mcs drexel edu


End of Volume 25 Issue 89