Volume 26 Number 32
                      Produced: Sun Apr 27  9:58:52 1997

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Ahare Mot-Kedoshim
         [Baruch Schwartz]
Counting the Omer after the Seder
         [Paul Merling]
Hallel and the Seder
         [Akiva Miller]
Matza before Pesach
         [Chana Luntz]
Mikveh at Night
         [Gershon Dubin]
         [Michael J Broyde]
Roasting for the Sedarim
         [Andrea Penkower Rosen]
Shehecheeyanu for Sfeeras Haomer
         [Merling, Paul]
The Kosher Pork or Can Pork Really Be Kosher???
         [Stephen Jerome]
What Vitroil is Chametz?
         [Michael J Broyde]


From: <SCHWARTZ@...> (Baruch Schwartz)
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 97 09:01:52 IST
Subject: Ahare Mot-Kedoshim

 This year, for the first time since 5733 (1973), Ahare Mot and Kedoshim
will be read separately AND neither of them will be Rosh Hodesh, Mahar
Hodesh or Shabbat HaGadol. Thus, for the first time in 24 years, it will
be necessary to read a regular haftarah for each of these parashiyot.
This is extremely rare, and will not happen again, I think, until 5784
 In most leap-years, of course, only one haftarah is read, since one of
the the parashiyot always coincides with Rosh Hodesh, Mahar Hodesh or
Shabbat HaGadol. In most communities, the custom is always to read the
haftarah from Amos (Halo khivnei khushiyyim) and put aside the one from
Ezekiel--this, whether the "free" shabbat is Ahare Mot or Kedoshim. This
is done in non-leap years as well--the haftarah from Amos is read when
Ahare Mot and Kedoshim are combined. This year, however, both shabbatot
are "free"--each one requires its own haftarah.
 For a full explanation of the approaches to the question of which
haftarah should be read on each of these shabbatot, including the
possible solutions and eye-witness account of the practice in several
Jerusalem congregations, I recommend the article by R. Shmuel
Weingarten, originally published in 5730 and 5733 and reprinted in this
year's Shana BeShana, published by Hechal Shlomo, pp. 328-344.
 Baruch Schwartz


From: Paul Merling <MerlingP@...>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 97 15:20:00 PDT
Subject: Counting the Omer after the Seder

            In a previous post I talked about reasons for the custom of 
counting the Omer after the Seder. I discussed this with some friends and 
was told that by many Chasidim, people get together with their Rebbes for a 
Tisch(no food) after the home Seder and Count the Omer with great fervor. 
Chad Gadya etc. is sung together. As I reported before, this Mitsva is done 
with great joy and anticipation.
         My feeling is that this Chassidic custom is not the source of
the custom of postponing Sfeeras Haomer, because in Europe few Chassidim
lived in the vicinity of their Rebbe and one did not travel to the Rebbe
for Pesach. Counting after the Seder must have been an already
established Minhag which Chassidim practiced and then came the added
custom of getting together for a mini Tisch where possible.
              Someone gave a good reason for the custom. Maybe if the
sfeera is done first, we declare that this is the 16th of Nisan (and we
do state this with great certainty, and that is why we disregard the
whole Sfeika Diyoma issue for this Mitsva.) Then how do we go after this
and make a Seder whose Mitsva is on the 15th of Nisan.
               I have heard such logic previously. If one is eating a
meal at the end of Shabbos and the meal shlepps into Rosh Chodesh, which
falls after Shabbos. Many say both Ritsei and Yaale Viyavo in the Bircas
Hamazon even though it is tarti disasree(a self contradiction). The
reason given is that since Ritsei is said first it is not a
contradiction. Maybe Rosh Chodesh arrived right after the
Ritsei. However, if the first day of Chanukah falls on a Motsaei Shabbos
we cannot say Al Hanissim and then say Ritsei, because if Chanuka
arrived what business do we have to say Ritsei.
                    Chag Kasher Visameiach


From: Akiva Miller <kgmiller@...>
Date: Thu, 24 Apr 1997 10:38:45 -0500
Subject: Hallel and the Seder

It seems to me that many traditions have been added to the Seder for the
specific purpose of keeping people awake and interested, but all of them
were placed in the first half of the Seder. In contrast, by the time we
reach the Grace after Meals and the Hallel portion of the Seder, it is
quite late, and the wine has been accumulating, and these prayers are
said all year round which detracts from the novelty of the night. I am
looking for ideas which will help the people at the table to be awake
and interested for the Hallel.

1) Does anyone have any authoritative information about the
permissibility of talking during this Hallel? The laws of the regular
Hallel, which is said as part of the prayer service, are quite strict,
allowing only interruptions such as are allowed for the Shema part of
the service, but perhaps these laws are more relaxed at the Seder. I
would love to be able to discuss each paragraph of the Hallel right then
and there while we are saying it at the Seder, as we do for the Story
portion of the Seder.

2) Most Hagadas offer little or no commentary on the Hallel. One option
is to learn the commentaries which appear in various editions of the
prayerbook, or of Psalms, but those tend to focus on Hallel itself. What
I'd really love is to see some commentaries which explain various
phrases of Hallel specifically in light of the Exodus. If anyone knows
of such, please let me know.

3) If anyone has any other ideas please let me know. (As I write this,
the thought occurs to me to check out Shimon Apisdorf's excellent
"Survival Guide" books, and I hope to remember to do so next time I see

Akiva Miller


From: Chana Luntz <heather@...>
Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 22:11:55 +0100
Subject: Matza before Pesach

In message <199704251458.KAA16686@...>, Avram Sacks writes
>I had learned some years ago that one should not eat matzah of any type,
>including egg and whole wheat, during the 30 days that precede Pesach,

This is:

a) a bit late for your question;
b) NOT a psak (as to what you should have done, you should ask a
competant Rav);  and
c) I did not see this inside;


something that came up at one of the sedarim I was at this year: - we
say in the Ma Nishtana - "on all other nights we eat Chametz OR Matza" -
so according to the person leading my seder, the GRA, as brought down by
his talmid the Brisker Rav, derives from this that the prohibition on
eating matza can only extend to the DAY of the 14th and not even the
night before - because otherwise we would be saying sheker [falsehood -
Mod.] when we ask the Ma Nishtana (ie, according to your version of the
minhag, there would be 30 nights on which we would not eat Chametz OR
Matza, but only Chametz - or the version I am familiar with, from Rosh
Chodesh Nissan, there would be 14 such nights) !! - and hence the minhag
is a minhag shtus!!!

Um!!??!! - is all i can say.

Moadim L'Simcha


From: <gershon.dubin@...> (Gershon Dubin)
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 10:16:10 EDT
Subject: Re: Mikveh at Night

>A more complex example is the one brought by Martin Rosen: Certainly
>Tzniuth has created many minhagim (like going to Mikvah by night). 

	Is there a source for the statement that going to the mikva at
night is because of (at least in part) tznius?  The halacha in shulchan
aruch is clear on several points:
	The fact that there is such a prohibition,  for a defined
"gezera" reason.
	The flexibility in cases where,  as earlier in this thread, 
women are afraid to go out at night for safety reasons.
	The difference in severity between the **seventh**  and
subsequent days.



From: Michael J Broyde <mbroyde@...>
Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 12:12:32 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Mushrooms

There was a series of exchanges dealing with mushrooms grown on chametz
which was quite interesting.  Halacha does not veiw mushrooms as "peri
ha'adama, and thus the general bracha on them is sha'hakol (SA OC 204:2).
Thus it is quite possible to assert that the relationship between a
mushroom as a fungus and the media that it grows on is different from that
of other fruits or from cows.  I have found no discussion of this issue,
and can envision both sides of this arguement.  However, it is relatively
clear to me that analogies to cows, people, or other fruit might not be
correct.  For more on this, see beit yosef on OC 204.

Mo'adim besimcha.

Michael J. Broyde
Emory University School of Law
Atlanta, GA 30322
Voice: 404 727-7546; Fax 404 727-3374


From: Andrea Penkower Rosen <apr@...>
Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 17:47:51 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Roasting for the Sedarim

For those of us who do not eat roasted meats or fowl for the sedarim,
what is the halachic definition of roasted?  and what is the source for
this definition?

Does this definition include all main courses prepared in the oven (as
opposed to on the top of the stove)?  Or does it omit foods which are
called baked in cookbook parlance and are prepared in the oven immersed
in a liquid?

Andrea Penkower Rosen


From: Merling, Paul <MerlingP@...>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 97 15:45:00 PDT
Subject: Shehecheeyanu for Sfeeras Haomer

            The most recent MESORAH (published by the OU,) has a piece
from Reb Yoshi Ber Soloveitchik Zatsal answering the question why we do
not say the blessing of Shehecheeyanu on the Mitsva of Counting the
Omer. I assume that the question is concerning the first night only, as
it is immaterial whether the 49 day count is one long Mitsva or 49
separate Mitsvas, there can only be one Shehecheeyanu.
            The Rav bases his remarks on a well known CHINUCH (305) that
states that the Mitsva of counting is to show our yearning for Matan
Torah, receiving the Torah on Shavuos. According to the Rav waiting for
the great coming event translates into pain as one is expressing a need
or significant lack. As Shehecheeyanu is a blessing of joy it is
inappropriate for Sfeeras Haomer. The Rav continues with a conjecture
that therefore there was an old custom to perform the Mitsva the second
night of Pesach after the Seder was completed, so as not to express this
painful need until after the joy and gratitude of the Seder.
               I remember as a child that my father O"BM did count the
Omer after the Seder, He discontinued this later. Does anybody know
about the survival of this custom? My father came from the town Bistriz
in Transylvania. Maybe it was a Minhag Hamakom?
               The Rav's view that the Mitsva of Sfeeras Haomer
signifies pain in some way is certainly not the Chassidic
viewpoint. Chassidim and particularly Karlin Chassidim perform the
Mitsva with great ecstasy and joy.  Sadness would be appropriate where
there is little hope of the wish fulfillment, but was this the mood of
our ancestors leaving Egypt? "Uvnei Yisraeil Yatsu Biyad Ramah" Were
they not told "When you take this people out of Egypt you will serve G-d
on this mountain?"
                One can prove that the joyful attitude is more probable
from our father Jacob who had to work seven years (at first) for Rachel
and the Torah says," It was like a few days in his love of her." Jacob
toiled for seven hard years but the time went by quickly as he was
working towards a goal that he desired greatly.
               Isn't it possible that the custom of counting the omer
after the Seder came about because synagogues ended Maariv too early and
when coming home the Mitsva was postponed till after the primary Doraisa
(torah required) mitsvos of Passover were finished?
               Chag Kosher Visameich


From: Stephen Jerome <sdjerome@...>
Date: Fri, 18 Apr 1997 00:36:23 -0400
Subject: The Kosher Pork or Can Pork Really Be Kosher???

Passover is about to arrive.  I am reminded of something which happened
about two years ago.  Passover was about a week away.  I had just read
that during Passover, Jewish dog owners could only keep dog foods which
were free of homitz.  I was (and am) the proud owner of a dog, so I
sought rabbinical advice.

The rabbi read from a list of permitted dog foods.  One of the brands on
the list was a "Beef and Bacon".  Bacon comes from the pig.  How could
this be, I asked?  Why would an Orthodox rabbi instruct me to bring a
pork product into my home.  The rabbi asked me "As you buying this for
yourself to eat or for your dog?"  He explained that it is not forbidden
for a Jew to possess the pork.  It was only forbidden for Jews to eat
pig products.  He went on to explain that the Talmud expressly states
that if a Jew has pork, he should feed to the dogs.  Since I had a dog,
this would follow the Talmudic instruction.

The rabbi also noted that this rule was in contrast to feeding the dog a
mixture of milk and meat.  Jews are expressly prohibited from deriving
any benefit from mixing milk and meat.  That, he explained, included
feeding it to a dog.  (I had to tell my beloved mutt, Duke, "Sorry, no
more beef and cheese dog foods, and no more cheesburgers.  However, you
can enjoy a ham sandwich!")

Now why would the Talmud expressly direct Jews to feed pork to the dogs?
Certainly, the Talmud would not direct a Jew to perform an act that
violates the laws of Kashruth.  After pondering the question, I realized
the answer: We are told to feed pork to the dogs because pork is Kosher
for dogs!

Note that the Talmud does not tell us to feed pork to Gentiles.  That is
because the laws of Kashruth do not apply to Gentiles.  However, the
Talmud gives us a directive to feed pork to the dogs. While pork is
certainly not Kosher for a Jew to eat, it is Kosher for our beloved
pooches.  Thus, by feeding pork to our dogs, we are actually helping
them to keep Kosher!  A Mitzvah in and of itself!

A very joyous and Kosher Passover for you - and your dogs!

Stephen D. Jerome

P.S.: A point to ponder: does this mean that we should make sure that
the pig was properly slaughtered kosher, and that it was salted and
soaked.  Do we need a Shochet?  I'll have to ask my rabbi!


From: Michael J Broyde <mbroyde@...>
Date: Fri, 25 Apr 1997 09:47:39 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: What Vitroil is Chametz?

The Beit Yosef in Orach Chaim 442:10 ues the word vitroil in reference
to a product which is chametz.  Does anyone know what he is refering to,
as the "standard" vitroil in ink does not appear to be chametz (In
short, I need HELP from a linguist or a chemist).

Michael J. Broyde
Emory University School of Law
Atlanta, GA 30322
Voice: 404 727-7546; Fax 404 727-3374


End of Volume 26 Issue 32