Volume 31 Number 40
                 Produced: Mon Feb  7  5:45:44 US/Eastern 2000

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

3 chilling stories
         [Jeanette Friedman]
Benediction Without Head Covered
         [Yisrael Medad]
Chazak Chazak v'NisChazek (2)
         [Gilad J. Gevaryahu, Carl M. Sherer]
Cholov Yisroel (2)
         [Alexis Rosoff, Esther Zar]
Copying disks
         [Steve Leichman]
Feeling Invisible
         [Janice Gelb]
Historical Authenticity of the Artscroll Siddur
         [Stephen H White]
Jewish Encyclopedia for Kids
         [Jonathan Rabson]
Pollard (2)
         [Chaim Shapiro, Yisrael Medad]
Secular colleges
         [Chaim Shapiro]
Shabbat hotel sensor-controlled lights (2)
         [Carl Singer, Ahron Wolf]
Why some Gedolim as known as "The" Godol
         [Ed Bruckstein]


From: Jeanette Friedman <FriedmanJ@...>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 19:36:32 EST
Subject: Re: 3 chilling stories

<< How frum society actually responds to question, challenge and doubt
can have an impact, as well.  In many frum circles, if you ask the wrong
question, think the wrong idea, you run the risk of being labeled,
rightly or wrongly, the apikores.  It is intellectually and socially
daunting to run such a gauntlet.  The result may often be running away,
rather than running the gauntlet, in the attempt to answer your
questions. It can happen anywhere, and it can happen no where. >>

Unfortunately, Judaism has much to fear from itself.  We have too much
to clean up in our own house without closing off options to the outside,
challenging, sometimes dangerous, sometimes cleansing, exciting, eye
opening world.  Let each of us know their own limitations and not assume
that everyone else is like our weakest link. It is limiting, and
ultimately self-defeating.>>

How right you are. The $64,000 question is what can you do to make this
critical, ethical, emotional adjustment in the community?  It was NOT
treyf to work in Europe. It was not treyf to be part of the world. What
happened?  And who changed it? Who made these new rules that are clearly
driven by fear of coping?

If you can cope, you can survive. Otherwise you are doomed.

Jeanette Friedman


From: Yisrael Medad <isrmedia@...>
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 21:29:13 +0200
Subject: Benediction Without Head Covered

At 15:04 06/02/00 +0000, Yeshaya Halevi <CHIHAL@...> wrote:
>Gevalt, Yisrael Medad: your singular question leads one to sift
>through many sources before that question can even be considered, let
>alone answered.

 Well, here's another reference from real life:
 my History instructor at YU, Professor Agus, outside the school, only
wore a kippah when making a bracha despite the fact that he was
extremely observant.  I was at his home and was witness to his custom.

As for questions, without asking, one doesn't learn, even if one isn't


From: Gilad J. Gevaryahu <Gevaryahu@...>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 12:06:16 EST
Subject: Chazak Chazak v'NisChazek

Ezra Tepper (v31n35) says:

<<Following the various contributions on this topic, one should note that
the Rema writes (Orah Hayim, 139:11) that following every aliya the
congregation praises or adjures the man called up with "Chazak" (be
strong). This has somehow been transformed into "Yashar Ko'ach," whose
meaning has been discussed in mail.jewish, but which expresses the same
idea. I have no idea why this change took place. The Rema writes the
origin of this custom is derived from the words of Joshua to the
children of Israel, "chazak ve'ematz" (be strong and corragous) --
Joshua 1:6,7,9,18.>>

This summer I visited Rome and saying "Chazak" instead of the Ashkenazic
"Yeshar Kochacha" or the Sephardic "Chazak uBaruch" is the custom in the
big synagogue of Rome today.

Gilad J. Gevaryahu

From: Carl M. Sherer <cmsherer@...>
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 15:54:11 +0200
Subject: Chazak Chazak v'NisChazek

Actually, the transformation you refer to is not universal. For many
years, my father-in-law was the Rabbi at one of the Persian shuls in the
Chicago area. After an aliya, the oleh would turn to the congregation
and say "kulchem bruchim tihyoo" (you should all be blessed) and the
congregation would respond, "chazak u'baruch tihye" (may you be strong
and blessed).

-- Carl M. Sherer
mailto:<cmsherer@...> or mailto:sherer@actcom.co.il
Please daven and learn for a Refuah Shleima for my son, Baruch Yosef ben
Adina Batya among the sick of Israel.  Thank you very much.


From: Alexis Rosoff <alexis@...>
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 21:28:43 -0500
Subject: Re: Cholov Yisroel

On Tue 1 Feb 2000 13:13:52 +0200, Carl M. Sherer wrote: 

|> Unless things have changed in the 25 years since I last lived in Boston,
|> it does not. Many dairies in the US have hashgochos (supervision) from
|> Rabbinic organizations that do not mean that the milk is "cholov
|> yisroel" in the sense that people commonly refer to "cholov yisroel."
|> AFAIK, this is "cholov hacompanies" with a hashgacha that watches what
|> goes into the plants and not the milking itself.

There are several reasons for it, as far as I can work out:

1) There is a segment of the population that observes kashrut but is
unaware of the Chalav Yisrael/`chalav hacompanies' distinction (there
are a fair number of Conservative Jews who do this) and/or automatically
look for the hechsher on everything they buy, and the OU and other
kashrut supervision agencies provide the hechsher to reassure customers
although it may not be halachically necessary;

2) Dairy products in the United States often include other things. I
once actually read the ingredients label on a pint of heavy cream. It
includes carragenan (I have probably mis-spelt that) which IIRC is a
seaweed product. Regular milk is normally fortified with vitamins as
well. Even if peope are not super-strict about kashrut (keeping glatt,
chalav yisrael, etc) they may well draw the line when they know the
product is not pure milk.

 Alexis Rosoff ---=--- http://www.mono.org/~alexis ---=--- Long Island, NY

From: Esther Zar <ESTABESTAH@...>
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 17:58:35 EST
Subject: Re: Cholov Yisroel

For all those who requested sourcing re: Reb Moshe's regret/withdrawal
re: cholov yisroel- i spoke to the rav who i quoted the information
from. He told me that he must get individual permission from the gedolim
who he spoke to about the issue who supplied him with that
information. he did say however that he spoke to several halachic
mainstream accepted authorities about the subject and that that is where
his information came from.  i saw in his notebook a copy of a letter
response from Reb Moshe to Rav Avraham Weinfeld dated rosh chodesh Tamuz
5717 and i requested permission to photocopy it which he granted.
so.. if anyone wants me to when it was written.


From: Steve Leichman <SteveL59@...>
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 12:09:16 EST
Subject: Re: Copying disks

David Charlap laid out very clear and accurate guidelines about copying
computer disks. Since I write software for a living, I take it very
personally when people copy (that is, steal) software. But I'm in a
situation that I would like to throw out for discussion.

I recently purchased a product directly from Davka Software. It turned
out that the product was pretty poor and did not do what I wanted it to
do. When I attempted to return the product to Davka, after removing it
from my computer, I was told that once the box has been opened they will
not accept returns. So I am stuck with a $40 3.5" floppy diskette that
is useless.  (Buyer beware about Davka Software.) There is another Davka
product that is much more expensive that I would like to purchase, but I
don't want to get burned again if the product turns out to be lousy. A
friend of mine has the product and also has a CD-burner. May he copy the
product and give it to me on a trial basis? If I like it, I will
purchase a legitimate copy from Davka.  If it's a dog, I will removed it
from my computer. Is this permitted?

Steve Leichman


From: Janice Gelb <j_gelb@...>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 10:02:02 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Feeling Invisible

Ellen Krischer <krischer@...> wrote:
> Janice Gelb <j_gelb@...> wrote:
>> However, I am willing to bet that if she has been regularly 
>> attending  your morning minyan, she either does not feel
>> invisible at not being counted or is willing to put up with
>> being invisible If not being counted bothered her, she probably
>> would not be attending an Orthodox synagogue, or at least she 
>> has already steeled herself to put up with that feeling.
> My experience is quite different Janice.  I know intelligent (maybe
> that's the problem :-( **), committed, serious, orthodox women who
> attend synagogue but for whom it still hurts sometimes to be invisible.
> It is especially bad when a Rav decides that's the day for a sermon on
> how the experience of Tefillin in a metaphor for "our" relationship
> with God.

If you read my entire message again, I think you will see that I didn't
say the woman absolutely didn't feel invisible.  I said she had probably
steeled herself to feeling invisible if she was still going to an O

The point I was trying to make is that it wouldn't only be in the
situation that Rabbi Adler described that the woman would feel
invisible. You cut out the part in my response where I said she probably
felt equally invisible when they were dividing up Torah honors as she
did in the described situation where there were only 9 men and she was
not eliible to be counted as a tenth.

-- Janice


From: Stephen H White <stephen@...>
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 20:45:50 +0000
Subject: Historical Authenticity of the Artscroll Siddur

The Artscroll Siddur has become increasingly influential in determining
the Nusach and the Minhagim (customs) of many Kehillot, particularly
those with no historical background of their own. What is its own
historical authenticity? Is it a hybrid, or a faithful reproduction of a
specific line of Tefillah? Does it matter, given the wide range of

Stephen White


From: Jonathan Rabson <JRabson@...>
Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2000 20:32:00 -0000 
Subject: Jewish Encyclopedia for Kids

Our local Beis Yaakov primary (elementary) school is looking for a
CD/computer-based Jewish encyclopedia or other similar resource that
could be used for girls between ages 6 and 11.  The UK national
curriculum for Information Technology requires kids to learn the skills
of indexing, hyperlinks, researching topics and navigation; however, the
excellent secular children's encyclopedias cannot be used by Beis Yaakov
schools without close supervision.  Can anyone help with suggestions of
other schools who have solved this, or know of suitable suppliers?  With
thanks in advance.

Jonathan Rabson


From: Chaim Shapiro <Dagoobster@...>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 14:23:48 EST
Subject: Pollard

<< Do not speak for David Luchins. It is my understanding that he has
backed off his anti Pollard stance considerably.

Jordan >>

It is my understanding, Jordan, that Luchkins supports Pollards release
on Rachmonus (Mercy) grounds rather than legal grounds!

Chaim Shapiro

From: Yisrael Medad <isrmedia@...>
Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 21:44:12 +0200
Subject: Pollard

Jordan Hirsch <TROMBAEDU@...> wrote:
>Do not speak for David Luchins. It is my understanding that he has
>backed off his anti Pollard stance considerably.

As David will be speaking here in Jerusalem on Feb. 13th at the Israel
Center, we'll soon know.  As I have known David personally for some 30
years now, and have spoken to him many, many times, I can say that David
has some very original and unique opinions and approaches to the Pollard
situation most of which would be considered more "anti" than anything
 Yisrael medad


From: Chaim Shapiro <Dagoobster@...>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 14:17:43 EST
Subject: Secular colleges

Following my personality, I was very argumentative in all my classes
about just about anything.  Most people accepted my opinion, and fought
hard to express their contrary views.  There were two issues, however,
which I was not allowed to comment on.  In fact, every time I did, I was
told I cannot talk because I have a religious perspective, which has no
place in university discourse.  Those two issues were abortion and
homosexual rights.  All my arguments to the validity of a religious
perspective were completely ignored!

Chaim Shapiro


From: Carl Singer <CARLSINGER@...>
Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2000 19:54:47 EST
Subject: Re: Shabbat hotel sensor-controlled lights

<< Our advice to anyone who plans on spending Shabbat in a modern hotel
is to check out whether this is an issue where you plan to stay, so you
can either plan how to get around the problem or to choose a different
hotel. >>

Fortunately my hotel days are mostly behind me (and I seldom stayed in
hotels for Shabbos) -- but many hotels had a few "manual" rooms --
either multi-purpose rooms (guest / meeting) that you could request
ahead of time.  Most hotel employees will bend over backwards to
accomodate you (that's why it's called the hospitality industry) if
treated with respect and given enough time to deal with the situation.

Awareness is the key point -- thanks for the reminder.

Carl Singer

From: Ahron Wolf <awolf@...>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 10:05:21 -0500
Subject: Shabbat hotel sensor-controlled lights

I'm not so sure that this is such a problem, isnt it Psik Reishei D'lo
Nicha Lei?



From: Ed Bruckstein <elbendi@...>
Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2000 11:11:16 -0500
Subject: Why some Gedolim as known as "The" Godol

I believe Artscroll in the introduction to one of its translations
explains why Rashi isn't referred to as "The Rashi", while we refer to
"The Ramban", "The Rosh", etc.

When Chumashim and Gemora's were first being printed, only Rashi (and
Tosfos) appeared on the page.  The other Rishonim were printed
separately.  So when someone wanted to look something up, he'd ask for
"The Ramban", "The Rosh", as in the volume which had their Peirush
(explanations).  No one would ask for "The Rashi", because it was
included in the Chumash or Gemara.  People got into the habit of saying
"The Maharal says", because they were quoting the volume rather than the

It is for this reason that Artscroll has omitted the article "The"
before these Rishonim's names, despite it sounding somewhat strange to
our ears, having become accustomed to the preface.

Eliezer Bruckstein


End of Volume 31 Issue 40