Volume 32 Number 27
                 Produced: Mon May 15  6:57:22 US/Eastern 2000

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Dune SF and "Kwisatz Haderach"
Electric Wheelchairs for Handicapped and Elderly Individuals.
         [Ezra Rosenfeld]
         [Joshua Hoffman]
Miscellaneous Comment
         [Yisrael Medad]
Mizmor L'Dovid (2)
         [A.J.Gilboa, Geoffrey Shisler]
Not eating Nuts on Yomim Noraim (6)
         [William J Scherman, Hillel (Sabba) Markowitz, Shlomo B Abeles,
Mordechai, Kenneth G Miller, Roger & Naomi Kingsley]
Seder on Motzaei Shabbat
         [Aliza N. Fischman]
Seder on Motzei Shabbat
         [David Kramer]
Yom Ha'Atzmut / Yom Yerushalayim versus Tisha B'Av.
         [Immanuel Burton]
         [David Cohen]


From: Chihal <chihal@...>
Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 14:08:46 -0500
Subject: Dune SF and "Kwisatz Haderach"

        Many esteemed colleagues here have a background in science
fiction too.  If so, they have noted that in Frank Herbert's great
classic, "Dune," and the new Dune "prequel," "Dune: House Atreides," the
concept of the "Kwisatz Haderach" (author's spelling) is employed.  In
"Dune," the "Kwisatz Haderach" literally, "Shortening of the Way" -- was
a human whose mental power lay in being able to bridge space and time.

        Rashi, commenting on the journey of the spies in
Bameedbar/Numbers 13:25, quotes Sotah 34 where it is said God shortened
their trip.  I seem to recall an Agada where the term used is "K'veetzat
Haderech" (shortening/gathering of the road) or perhaps "Kfeetzach
Hadereach" (jumping of the road) to enable the spies to return sooner
rather than later.

        Can anyone enlighten me with info on the Jewish concept of the
"Kwisatz Haderach?"


From: Ezra Rosenfeld <zomet@...>
Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 13:44:37 +0300
Subject: Electric Wheelchairs for Handicapped and Elderly Individuals.

I would like to set the record straight.

 Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach zt"l was greatly disturbed by the fact that
elderly and handicapped individuals who, thanks to their electric
wheelchairs were completely independent throughout the week, but were
relegated to relying on other people for favors or staying home on
shabbat.  He thus permitted design of an electric vehicle which
partially operated on the principle of gramma, in order to allow these
people to go to shul, visit friends or just go for a "walk" on shabbat.

Rav Auerbach's position, as related to Zomet on many occasions (he
served as our poseik until his death),was that a person's dignity was
compromised by not being able to use his vehicle and that rabbinic
prohibitions could be ignored if they compromised one's "kevod

In his eulogy for Rav Auerbach, attended by hundreds of people, Rav
Aaron Lichtenstein told of his conversation with Rav Auerbach concerning
the welectric wheelchair. He quoted Rav Auerbach as saying that (this is
my recollection of his words, the quote may only be 90% accurate) "for
some reason that I cannot understand, G-d has taken away freedom of
mobility from this person, how can I ("Rav Shlomo Zalman) take away his
"oneg shabbat".  This was typical of Rav Shlomo Zalman whose responsa
always exhibit a special sensitivity for the questioner and his problem.

To conclude: Not all poskim agreed with Rav Shlomo Zalman's psak. Zomet
is not happy with the advertisements which have appeared in the press
(and we have made our feelings known to the companies which market the
Shabbat wheelchair) . However, the truth cannot be ignored, Rav Shlomo
permitted use of a gramma operated electric vehicle on Shabbat, for the
handicapped and the elderly, men and women, and not just for going to

Ezra Rosenfeld
Executive Director -Zomet


From: Joshua Hoffman <JoshHoff@...>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 10:06:36 EDT
Subject: Re: Kitzur

<<  A bit of snobbery - KSA is only for kids - not us lomdim. >>

The Kitzur is treated by poskim as a shita-it is more than just a kids'
book.  About 15 yrs.ago a then-newly -found letter by Rav Shlomo
Ganzfried was published.In the letter he gives a description of the
process he followed in arriving at his pesakim in the Kitzur.Rav
Ganzfried was a great lamdan,as is readily apparent to anyone who learns
his Lechem V'Simlah on Hilchos Mikvaos and Nidah. Although the Kitzur
was written as a popular, practical guide to halacha, there is more
chochma in it than many think.


From: Yisrael Medad <isrmedia@...>
Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 20:56:48 +0300
Subject: Miscellaneous Comment

Upon reading this:-
>Rav Dovid Lifshitz  zt'l had the practice, on Yamim Noram, of saying the last
>section of the Avinu Malkeinus out loud, after everyone else had finished,
>even though he wasn't the shliach tzibbur.He would always break down when he
>reachd the one referring to those burned and slaughtered.

I recalled that Rav Lifschitz was the Suvalki Rav, the town in
northeastern Poland which was also the home town of Avraham Stern, later
to become known as Yair, the founder of the Fighters for the Freedom of
Israel (Lechi).  He had very good connections with the youngsters of the
Zionist movements there, many who later aided illegal immigrants to
arrive in pre-war mandated Palestine, thus avoiding the Holocaust.


From: A.J.Gilboa <bfgilboa@...>
Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 13:40:31 -0700
Subject: Re: Mizmor L'Dovid

> From: Rachi Messing <rachim@...>
> As I was sitting in shul this shabbos it struck me that most shuls sing
> Mizmor L'dovid as we put away the Torah in a responsive manner. Is there
> any source for the entire kehal not saying a tfillah in its entirety?

Responsive prayer is a very ancient practice in Judaism. This is
especially true of public recitation of Psalms (thillim), many of which
are composed in a style that fairly begs for responsive performance.
Note especially the psalms of the Hallel service. The practice is also
clearly evident in such central prayers (dvarim she-biqdusha) as Barchu,
kaddish and kdusha. Actually, in the case of kdusha, the common
Ashkenazi practice of the tsibbur reciting the hazzan's lines BEFORE
him, is questionable at best. (This issue has been discussed previously
in MJ.) The responsive prayer mode has been carried into many of the
piyyutim as well, although, again, we Ashkenazim have often succeeded in
defeating the intention of the paytan by insisting on reciting the
hazzan's lines before him. In the case of mizmor l-david, the common
responsive performance does not actually follow the implied responsive
mode of the text, which seems to divide each pasuq into two parallel
halves, e.g.,  "havu la-shem bne elim"  vs.  "havu la-shem kavod
va-`oz". But in answer to your original question, I think it is safe to
say that it is not at all unusual for our prayers to be recited

Yosef Gilboa

From: Geoffrey Shisler <geoffrey@...>
Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 20:27:23 +0100
Subject: Re: Mizmor L'Dovid

>From: Rachi Messing <rachim@...>
>As I was sitting in shul this shabbos it struck me that most shuls sing
>Mizmor L'dovid as we put away the Torah in a responsive manner. Is there
>any source for the entire kehal not saying a tfillah in its entirety?

This is not the case where I come from (the UK). I only ever heard
Mizmor LeDavid sung responsively in Israel. It's obviously someone's
composition (does anyone know whose?) that has caught on.

Here the practice is for the congregation to sing it together all the
way through.

Rabbi Geoffrey Shisler
Bournemouth (Orthodox) Hebrew Congregation
UK                                              <Rav@...>


From: William J Scherman <zscherman@...>
Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 22:25:16 -0400
Subject: Not eating Nuts on Yomim Noraim

Clear minhag,  because the Hebrew word for nut, EGOZ, has a gematria --
numeric value-- of 17, as does kHeT, the word for sin (sans Alef).  Nuts
are also known to thicken the saliva, and perhaaaps interfere with
prayer.  Some don't eat them until after Yom Kipur, others until after
Hoshana Rabba or Shmini Atzeres

From: Hillel (Sabba) Markowitz <sabbahillel@...>
Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 21:38:00 -0400
Subject: Re: Not eating Nuts on Yomim Noraim

> From: Carl Singer <CARLSINGER@...>
> My wife's family is not to eat nuts during the Yomim Noraim -- she's a
> Litvak (I hope this isn't loshen horah :) -- and a descendent on her
> mother's side (hence food stuff?) from the Goan.  I'm not sure but I
> believe it's somehow linked to the Hebrew word for nuts and its
> similarity to other words -- Does anyone have insight on this and
> similar customs?

The gematriya of egoz (aleph gimel vav zayin) is 1 + 3 + 6 + 7 = 17
The gematriya of cheit (ches tes aleph) is 8 + 9 + 1 = 18

Many gematriya accept the within one as they add one for the word

I heard from the Rabbi Berel Wein that the Kotzker Rebbe quipped that
many people forget that the gematriya of cheit is cheit.  That is they
are stricter on avoiding nuts on the yamim noraim than they are about
avoiding sin during the entire year.

> We also do several "yehee ratzon's" re: food types (fish head  to
> pomegranate) at Rosh Hoshanah meals.

How about eating lettuce, half of a raisin, and celery

Lettuce half a raisin celery. (:-)

Said the fox to the fish, "Join me ashore" | Hillel (Sabba) Markowitz
 Jews are the fish, Torah is our water | Zovchai Adam, agalim yishakun

From: Shlomo B Abeles <sba@...>
Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 01:41:54 +1000
Subject: Not eating Nuts on Yomim Noraim

Shulchan Oruch 583 - Egoz is gematria Chet and also because
eating nuts increases saliva, which may cause some
inconvenience during the many tefilos of the Yomim Noroim.

Shlomo B Abeles

From: Mordechai <Phyllostac@...>
Date: Sun, 7 May 2000 16:34:45 EDT
Subject: Not eating Nuts on Yomim Noraim

The nut custom is mentioned by the Ram"a in the Shulchan Oruch (Orach Chaim 
583:2) in the name of the Mahari"l as a 'yesh midakdikim' [some are careful 
to do it}. Therefore it seems that it is an general Ashkenazic custom - as 
opposed to that of only Litvaks. Two reasons are given. 1- because EGOZ is 
bigimatria (has same numerical value in hebrew as) chet (sin). 2- Because 
consuming them has physical side effects that can negatively affect one's 
ability to pray properly. Some people think that Egoz means all nuts and 
therefore refrain from all nuts. However, I have heard it said / seen written 
that EGOZ more accurately means (just) walnuts. However, I notice that the 
'Beer Heitev' commentary seems to say that another type of nut 
[hazelnuts/filberts?] also have the effect cited in reason # 2.

The Yehi Ratzon's are a more universal (and more ancient) custom.


From: Kenneth G Miller <kennethgmiller@...>
Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 00:30:03 EDT
Subject: Not eating Nuts on Yomim Noraim

The connection is that the gematria for "egoz" (nut) - spelled aleph(1)
gimel(3) vav(6) zayin(7) - is the same as the gematria for "chet" (sin) -
spelled chet(8) tet(9) aleph(1). This is explicit in the Shulchan Aruch,
said by the Rama in 583:2. (The Rama gives an additional reason, that
nuts increase one's saliva output, which messes up the davening. But
gematria is his first reason.)

The curious fact, though, is that "egoz" adds up to 17, and "chet" comes
to 18. I've heard some say that the aleph of chet doesn't count because
it is silent. I've heard others say that this proves cute gematrias don't
have to match exactly.

Akiva Miller

From: Roger & Naomi Kingsley <rogerk@...>
Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 19:31:57 +0300
Subject: Re: Not eating Nuts on Yomim Noraim

This is brought by the Rema in the Shulchan Aruch , 583, 2 where he
gives as reasons that nut - egoz in Hebrew - has the same gematria as
chet (sin) (actually you have to leave off the aleph from chet to get
this) and that they increase phlegm and saliva which interferes with
prayer.  The Be'er Hetev writes that the second reason would  make the
nuts forbidden.

Roger Kingsley

[Similar responses from:
From: Shlomo B Abeles <sba@...>
From: Eli Turkel <turkel@...>
From: Asher Goldstein <mzieashr@...>


From: Aliza N. Fischman <fisch.chips@...>
Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 13:14:27 -0400
Subject: Seder on Motzaei Shabbat

First of all, Josh Hosseinoff, Yishar Kochacha.  Your detailed list blew me

>From: Israel Medad <isrmedia@...>
>As for Jeff Fischer <NJGabbai@...> suggestion,
> >Usually, people divide the 2nd meal into 2.  They say kiddush, hamotzi
> >and take a bite of something (cake), then bench, take a walk and come
> >back and wash again for Shalosh Seudot.

My husband has clear recolections of growing up in Elizabeth with a
Motzei Shabbat seder.  He remembers eating on napkins and then the whole
family brushing themselves off over the toilet so no crumbs would drop


From: David Kramer <DTK1950@...>
Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 10:55:18 EDT
Subject: Seder on Motzei Shabbat

Yisrael Medad writes:
<<The other major discomfort (besides the vatikin minyan) is that the chametz 
left over is to be hidden and burnt after Chag.>>

Is burning the only option?  Can't we flush it down the toilet (assuming
the pieces are small enough)?  Even if we assume burning is necessary,
am I correct that the burning would have to be done on Chol Hamoed?


From: Immanuel Burton <iburton@...>
Date: Mon, 8 May 2000 11:46:00 +0100
Subject: Yom Ha'Atzmut / Yom Yerushalayim versus Tisha B'Av.

Is saying Hallel (with or without a blessing) on Yom Ha'Atzmut and/or Yom
Yerushalayim inconsistent with fasting on Tisha B'Av?

 Immanuel M. Burton                     |    Tel: +44 (0)20-8802 9736 x0250
 I.T. Manager                           |    Fax: +44 (0)20-8802 9774
 Better Properties Limited              | 
 129 Stamford Hill, London N16 5TW, UK  |  Email: <iburton@...>


From: David Cohen <bdcohen@...>
Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 14:00:47 -0400
Subject: Zomet

Just to follow up on Russel Hendel's post in Vol 32 #15,
I too heard the same story at least twice from Ezra Rosenfeld, the
director of Zomet.

    In addition, Zomet's journal, Crossroads, published an article on
the subject, "The Electric Wheelchair on Shabbat" by Rav Yair Meir in
volume 3.  For the more advanced, there is " Kovetz Maamarim B'inyanei
Chashmal" which deals extensively with these issues.

David I. Cohen


End of Volume 32 Issue 27