Volume 36 Number 51
                 Produced: Tue Jun 18 22:29:43 US/Eastern 2002

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Card Operated Locks
         [Steve Weisberg]
Chazon Ish, rabbi in Kosow-Poleski, Belarus?
         [Paul Ginsburg]
Exception that proves the rule
         [Emmanuel IFRAH]
Hukat - Balak
         [Menashe Elyashiv]
Kitzur Maskanot Sheelot uTeshuvot Bnei Banim
         [Rabbi Y. H. Henkin]
Kosher food, but what about Shabbat in space (2)
         [Stephen Colman, Stephen Phillips]
looking for story about Rav Sach and about GRa
Minchat Yerushalyim Siddur
         [Alan Friedenberg]
Modesty and the Ari's comments
         [Jonathan & Randy Chipman]
Nusach Artscroll
         [Dani Wassner]
seudat Hodaah
         [S. Schwartz]
Shabbat in space
Shabbos in space
         [Perets Mett]
Tehilat Hashem
         [Michael Toben]
Tevllas Kelim - Restaurants, etc.
         [Stephen Phillips]


From: Steve Weisberg <nydecs@...>
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 17:43:17 +0300
Subject: Re: Card Operated Locks

Intersting. That means the accepted practice in many fine Israeli hotels
doesn't "work": give the guests who request it, a regular key before
Shabbat to use during the Shabbat. This doesn't modify the workings of
the lock itself and doesn't solve much of the problem, according to this
psak. I'm interested in any follow-up. If I don't see anything
conclusive here, maybe I'll call Machon Tzomet (unless someone else


> From: Joseph Mosseri <JMosseri@...>
> Tzadik Vanderhoof asks about this in the last issue of mail Jewish.  For
> many years this issue has puzzled me. Finally Rabbi David Sheloush,
> Chief Rabbi of Netanya for the last 50 years has dealt with it.  In his
> newest sefer, Hemdah Genouzah, volume 2, page 158. he discusses it.  He
> says that the insertion of the card opens and/or closes an electric
> circuit which opens the door; closing the door of the room also
> completes an electric circuit.. He say this is not "gerama" rather the
> connection of a current and its interruption. and even if your intention
> is only to open the door it is still a "pesiq reshe, be isour derabanan"
> at least according to HaRambam.


From: Paul Ginsburg <GinsburgP@...>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 08:20:00 -0400
Subject: Chazon Ish, rabbi in Kosow-Poleski, Belarus?

I have read that Rabbi Karelitz, the Chazon Ish was a rabbi (Av Beis
Din) in Kosova.

Kosow-Poleski (Poland/Russia - today Belarus) is also known Kosova.  and
is located near Slonim and Pruzhany.

Does anyone know where the "Kosova" associated with the Chazon Ish was

Paul W. Ginsburg
Rockville, Maryland  


From: Emmanuel IFRAH <eifrah@...>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 12:53:27 +0200
Subject: Exception that proves the rule

"C'est l'exception qui confirme la rogle" is indeed a well-known phrase
in French.

However, its meaning is completely different from what I read in the
present discussion.  It does not mean that the exception is there to
test the rule, nor that you can infer the rule from the exception.

It is meant to signify a paradox: no rule is absolute, hence when you
find an exception, it means that the rule does exist. It's a slightly
twisted way of thinking but it results -- to the extent of my knowledge
-- from the French grammar in which you will find exceptions to any
rule, the exceptions being sometimes more numerous that the "normal"

Emmanuel IFRAH


From: Menashe Elyashiv <elyashm@...>
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 10:12:05 +0300 (IDT)
Subject: Hukat - Balak

Yesterday, Shabbat Parashat Hukat, 3 different Tora readings were read.
Most bnei Eretz Israel read Hukat, Yemenites read Hukat-Balak (some read
the 2nd 1/2 of Hukat because they split it in 1/2, the first 1/2 with
Korah), and in the Golah - Korah.

Next Shabbat - Balak in Israel, Yemenites - Pinhas, Golah - Hukat-Balak.
Yemenites do not double Matot- Masai, only in Yemen they doubled
Matot-Masai when the other Golah communities doubled Hukat-Balak.


From: Rabbi Y. H. Henkin <henkin@...>
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 17:02:45 +0200
Subject: Kitzur Maskanot Sheelot uTeshuvot Bnei Banim

A 16-page printed Hebrew summary of the conclusions reached in all three
volumes of Resp. Bnei Banim, siman by siman, is available for no charge
except postage. It is not necessary to purchase the sefarim in order to
receive the summary. Those living in Israel should send two local stamps
(2.40 NIS) and those living abroad, a US $1 bill, to:

Rabbi Yehuda Henkin, 1 Nurock Street, 96109 Jerusalem, Israel.


From: <StephenColman2@...> (Stephen Colman)
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 07:02:23 EDT
Subject: Re: Kosher food, but what about Shabbat in space

      From: Sam Saal <ssaal@...>
>   ...."Rabbi Romain did, however, offer a different way out of
> Col. Ramon's difficulty. "His fellow crew members are unlikely to
> appreciate him taking time off during what is likely to be a very
> intense mission, especially as it might endanger their lives," the rabbi
> said. "There is a Jewish principle which says that saving life takes
> precedent over all religious rituals, so on those grounds he could be
> relieved of his obligations."

This is indeed a very interesting subject and I recently heard (Shovuos
night) Dayan Y Abrahams of the London Beis Din give a facinating shiur
on a similar topic - Halochic issues regarding the International Date

However, before you start quoting the personal opinions of various
Rabbis - especially on Halochic issues - it is important to know exactly
who these rabbis are.  Of the two Rabbis that the Sunday Telegraph
quoted, I must point out that Jonathan Romain is the minister of the
Maidenhead reform community.

From: Stephen Phillips <stephenp@...>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 13:53 +0100 (BST)
Subject: Re: Kosher food, but what about Shabbat in space

> The article quotes two Rabbis: Rabbi Levy Yitzhak Halperin and Rabbi
> Jonathan Romain.

I believe Rabbi Halperin is director of the Jerusalem-based Institute
For Science and Halacha and I presume therefore he knows what he is
talking about.

> Rabbi Halperin, "ruled that the colonel should be relieved of his
> obligations because he will not be experiencing Earth time."

I feel, however, that he may have been misquoted or not quoted in full. I 
found the following at 

"I heard that Rabbi Levy Yitzhak Halperin, director of the
Jerusalem-based Institute For Science and Halacha, was recently asked by
an observant astronaut assigned to the space shuttle program how to
determine the times for prayers, Shabbat, etc. while in orbit around the
earth. He ruled that the calendar from "down here" applies only to
someone orbiting in the same direction as the earth as it turns on its
axis, and only if he is travelling no faster than the speed of the
earth! What if he is going faster or in the opposite direction? First
choice: "Don't go." Second choice: "Consult his rabbi.""

> "Rabbi Romain, who heads the Maidenhead synagogue, said: "Some rabbis
> say that because he will be in space, Earth rules don't apply. But my
> view is that, as you can't exist in space without re-creating Earth like
> conditions -- using oxygen, for example -- you should observe the same
> routine as you would on Earth."

The Maidenhead synagogue is Reform, so any "Psak" from its spiritual
head has to be treated with care.

Stephen Phillips.


From: f <fsmiles@...>
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 23:04:15 -0700
Subject: looking for story about Rav Sach and about GRa

do you know where to find these stories in hebrew?

Rav Shach went to funeral to a women who gave blankets to his yeshiva
when he was young as a hakarat hatov.

The Gra said the only Rebbe he had kavod for as a Rebbe was his aleph
bes teacher??

know where these stories are? thank you


From: Alan Friedenberg <elshpen@...>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 04:45:53 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Minchat Yerushalyim Siddur

I was told recently that the Minchat Yerushlayim siddur was not being
printed any longer.  Can anyone verify this for me?  Mine is falling
apart, and I would love to get a new one.

-- Alan --


From: Jonathan & Randy Chipman <yonarand@...>
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 16:29:07 +0300
Subject: RE: Modesty and the Ari's comments

       In v36n46, Russell J Hendel <rjhendel@...> expresses
surprise at a comment cited in the name of the ARI that "when one of his
students didn't come to the learning on Leil Shavuot... it was most
probably because of his wife's tevillat mitzvah."  Russell remarked that
"seriously violates several modesty regulations which prohibit people
from speaking about these matters EVEN IF NOT DONE LEWDLY. I know the
Ari was defending somebody but I still think the above statement too

     My comment/query: This is the sort of thing that "everyone knows."
Does Russell, or anyone else, know of any written halakhic source for

    And, while on the subject, another related question: It is customary
in many Orthodox circles for husband and wife not to hold hands or show
any other overt physical signs of affection (which would also imply that
the woman is taharah le-ba'alah) in public.  I once researched this
question, and found a halakhah to that effect, which in turn cited a
rather bizarre aggadah that someone (Elijah?) once entered the tomb of
Avraham and Sarah and found them in an embrace, and a gloss saying that
this was permitted because thwere is no Yetzer Hara after death.  Can
anyone supply the source: a) for this halakha; b) for the midrash.  I
tried searching again in the obvious places (Orah Hayyim 240; Even
ha-Ezer 25 and the precedung simanim; Rambam Issurei biah, last
two-three chapters) but could not find it.  Any takers?

Russell adds: <<(Of course this raises the issue whether OUR knowledge
of modesty should OVERRIDE the Aris statement..but I think it
should---at any rate I would invite further discussion)>>

    I would be less categorical, and assume the Ari acted according to
halakah unless proven otherwise (assuming the story, a) was recorded
correctly in the source cited and b) quoted correctly by the person who
submitted it to the list, who quotes from memory; maybe some crucial
element is missing).  Such is the regard we are supposed to have toward
"maaseh rav" of gedolei hahakhamim, including those if our own

Yehonatan Chipman, Yerushalayim


From: Dani Wassner <dani@...>
Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2002 12:57:45 +0200
Subject: RE: Nusach Artscroll

At the risk of being slightly risque on a list such as this:

I was recently sitting at a Shabbat meal and was discussing a particular
halacha. One person made a point that was clearly quoted directly from
the Artscroll Siddur. To this, another person at the table replied: "You
are talking out of your Artscroll".

Dani Wassner, Jerusalem


From: <SSCHWARTZ@...> (S. Schwartz)
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 08:09:02 EDT
Subject: seudat Hodaah


I, B"H, recently survived a hear attack. Someone mentioned to me that I
should have a Seudat Hodaah. After asking and searching, it seems very
difficult to find any concrete discussion of this written in Halacha.

Is anyone out there familiar with the source? What are the parameters ?
Do I need a minyan? Does it have to be on the "anniversary" of the
event? How is it different from "bentching Gomel"?

S. Schwartz


From: JBGross <jbgross@...>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 06:58:09 -0400
Subject: Shabbat in space

Why on Earth (sorry, I couldn't resist) would Mitzvos not apply to the
astronaut?  What source is offered for the assertion that Shabbat stops
at some altitude?

It would seem that the person in orbit is at each moment "located" in
the place directly below, and bound to its time-status.  As long as it
is Shabbos in any of the places on Earth over which the vehicle's obit
passes, the restrictions of Shabbos should apply (off and on in theory
-- but for practical purposes continuously) to the person in orbit.


From: Perets Mett <p.mett@...>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 15:21:35 +0100
Subject: Shabbos in space

Sam can be excused, not knowing England, and I wouldn't expect the
Telegraph to know better anyway.

Rabbi LY Halperin is one of the world's foremost halachic authorities 
on technological issues.

Jonathan Romain, who should not be mentioned in the same breath, 
subscribes to the Reform and his opinion on matters of halocho is not 
worth hearing.

Perets Mett


From: Michael Toben <toben@...>
Subject: Tehilat Hashem

I understand this addition to Shir HaMaalot was added during the early
days of the Zionist movement in Germany and Austria. The Zionists had
claimed that Birkat HaMazon was a strongly 'Zionist' prayer in its
sentiment. The more 'Universalists' among the Jews felt that by adding
the few verses at the end of Shir HaMalot that were counteracting the
'Zionist" tendencies of the prayer.  Unfortunately, I don't remember
where I read about this. It was quite some time ago. This explanation
goes a long way to explain why certain sidurim carry the 'extra' verses,
such as the English Singer's siddur which were strongly influenced by
German custom of the time, and none of those printed in Israel.

Michael Toben <toben@...>


From: Stephen Phillips <stephenp@...>
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2002 14:44 +0100 (BST)
Subject: Tevllas Kelim - Restaurants, etc.

Are there any licensees of Kashrus certificates out there who can tell
us whether their supervising Rabbinical authority insists on all
utensils being tovelled [dipped in a Mikveh]? I read an opinion that, as
the utensils are being used for profit making purposes, they do not need

Stephen Phillips.


End of Volume 36 Issue 51