Volume 48 Number 01
                    Produced: Mon May 23  6:00:45 EDT 2005

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Can you live 7 days w/o potato chips
         [Annice Grinberg]
Getting to the women's section
         [Ken Bloom]
Jefferson and Baba Kama
         [Bernard Raab]
         [Jack Gross]
Lubavitch dynasty
         [Arye Don Gordon]
Marrying one's late wife sister
         [Yitschak Maser]
Name Questions: Zushe and Pesha
Non-frum Jews and  Minyan
         [Ari Trachtenberg]
Religious Non-Zionists
         [Martin Stern]
Second day Yom Tov
         [Harry Weiss]
Shir Hashirim time of reading
         [Martin Stern]
Women and kaddish
         [David Maslow]


From: Annice Grinberg <annicey@...>
Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 13:27:23 +0200
Subject: Re: Can you live 7 days w/o potato chips

Janice wrote:

> I wouldn't argue for asceticism. On the other hand, the number of foods
> that are avaiilable kosher for Passover from the few suppliers that
> provide such food are limited, and to spend resources on making things
> kosher for Passover that one is unlikely to eat during the year on a
> daily or even weekly basis seems odd. I'd rather have them spend those
> resources on things that are actually useful for Passover cooking, like
> canned pineapple slices and crushed pineapple, which were
> uncharacteristically missing this year.)

Here in Israel, the only time we can get pineapple slices and pieces
packed in natural juice is before Pesach.  This year I bought enough to
(hopefully) get us through till next Pesach.  This was also the first
time I've found matzo farfel here, which was one of my pre-aliya Pesach
staples.  Broken matzos just don't fill the bill.

Anyway, if "junk food" and the like makes people happy and possibly
saves them work, why should they have to deprive themselves on Pesach?



From: Ken Bloom <kabloom@...>
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 23:17:14 -0700
Subject: Getting to the women's section

Aliza Berger <alizadov@...> wrote in v47n94:
> Unfortunately, it's easy to prevent a woman from saying kaddish or, more
> generally, from praying with the minyan.
> ...
> Or by locating the women's
> section so that if she comes one second late it is inaccessible (e.g,
> she would have to walk through the men's section to get to it).

Is it forbidden for a woman to talk through the mens section to reach
the women's section (and vice-versa)? Does it make a difference when
she's walking across the back of the men's section, rather than down the
middle where a lot men will see her?

Besides, how do these shuls manage on shabbat?

--Ken Bloom


From: Bernard Raab <beraab@...>
Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 17:16:07 -0400
Subject: Re: Jefferson and Baba Kama

>From: Alex Heppenheimer <aheppenh@...>
>Very interesting! Out of curiosity, I looked up the record for it in the
>LoC's online catalog. Assuming that I've found the right one
>then it's actually a Latin translation of Baba Kamma, printed in Leiden
>in 1637. Which means, I guess, that Jefferson was not _that_ much of a
>talmid chacham. :)
>From: Nathan Lamm <nelamm18@...>
>I highly doubt Jefferson had a Vilna Shas, which was published sixty
>years after his death. Of course, the Talmud, since its earliest printed
>editions, has followed the same basic format, so his would look similar
>to ours.
>While Jefferson himself didn't have much to do with the foundation of US
>law (he wasn't involved in writing the Constitution, for example), it
>certainly is true that the early Americans, in both the 17th and 18th
>Centuries, had great interest in Jewish traditions. I'm not sure if this
>would have filtered down to tort and insurance rules, though.

Many thanks to Alex for finding the catalogue reference. It is many
years since the LOC had this on display and I remember being struck that
the page layout was very familiar, although I am persuaded now that it
probably was not a Vilna shas. If it is a Latin translation, that has
escaped my memory, but would certainly explain his ability to read and
make notes in the margin, which is what I found most interesting.  I did
not really think that Jefferson had any significant input to American
civil law which follows almost completely the English common
law. Nevertheless his reading of Baba Kama specifically probably
indicates an interest in the historical development of civil tort law,
since Jefferson was a lawyer, of course, and in his last years was very
involved in the development of the University of Virginia in all its

b'shalom--Bernie R.


From: Jack Gross <jbgross@...>
Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 22:33:24 -0400
Subject: Kaddish

One does not say Kaddish as an individual -- one recites it in the role
of Shliach Tzibbur.

The reason some instances of Kaddish are "reserved" for aveilim
("kaddish yasom") is to accommodate those who cannot lead the full
service, or to satisfy the desire of the aveilim to lead part of the
service when there are multiple candidates among the aveilim.  Instances
of Kaddish that may have been added to accommodate mourners (when the
practice was to have only one person say each Kaddish) thereby became
part of the service.


- Kaddish should not be omitted when there happen to be no aveilim
present; the responsibility reverts to the sha"tz whether or not he
still has his parents.

- Where kaddish is recited by several aveilim, they should take care to
recite it in unison.  That is more easily accomplished if those reciting
kaddish stand together is a designated place.


From: <AryeDon@...> (Arye Don Gordon)
Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 17:30:44 EDT
Subject: Lubavitch dynasty

The 3rd Rebbe, AKA The Zemach Zedek, had the following children:

Descendants of Harav Menachem Mendel Schneersohn

 1   Harav Menachem Mendel Schneersohn 1789 - 1866
 .  +Chaya Mushka - 1861
 ..... 2   Baruch Shalom Schneersohn 1804 - 1869
 ..... 2   Yehuda Leyb Schneersohn 
 .........  +d1 Shlomo Freydes of Shklov 
 ..... 2   (Chayim) Schneur Zalman Schneersohn 1814 - 1879
 ..... 2   Harav Shmuel Schneersohn 1834 - 1882
 .........  +Sterna Schneersohn - 1849
 .....  *2nd Wife of Harav Shmuel Schneersohn: 
 .........  +Rivkah bas Rav Aharon 1834 - 1914
 ..... 2   Yisroel Noach Schneersohn - 1883
 .........  +Freida 
 ..... 2   Yosef Yitzchak1 Schneersohn 
 .........  +Chana Twersky 


Arye Don Gordon Los Angeles


From: Yitschak Maser <simone.maser@...>
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 21:54:47 +0200
Subject: Marrying one's late wife sister

Saul Mashbaum (Vol 47:92) asks two questions on marrying one's late
wife's sister 

>not only is it permissible to marry one's wife's sister after the death
>of one's wife, but it is considered meritorious...I am unfamiliar with
>the basis for this practice.  What are the sources for the concept that
>this is a particularly appropriate zivug (match)?

The Meshech Chochmah commenting on Vayikra 18:18 writes that "after her
death it is permitted (to marry her sister), indeed it is nichah loh
... as was taught by Yosef Hacohen (Zevachim 101)."

Saul Mashbaum continues:

>I have a separate but related question on the subject of marrying two
>sisters. As is well known, the prohibitions of incestual relationships
>appear in parshat Acharei Mot, and the punishments in Kdoshim. The
>prohibition of marrying two sisters (strictly, having relations with
>one's wife's sister during one's wifes's lifetime) is indeed mentioned
>in Acharei Mot, but no punishment is mentioned in Kdoshim at all! Does
>anyone discuss this?

To explain this omission, see Rabbi S. R. Hirsch zatsal on Vayikra 20:17
and Rabbi E. Munk zatsal (The Call of the Torah) on Vayikra 18:18
quoting the Ramban that this prohibition is unlike the others -- not so
much concerning blood relationship as avoiding rivalry.

This omission is explained by Rabbenu Bachya al hatorah as being in
deference to Yakov Avinu,who was deprived of attaining perfection
because of his marriage to two sisters (commentary on Vayikra 20:21-- "
likhvod Yaakov"). See Rabbi Munk zatsal on Bereshis 29:28.

Yitschak Maser


From: <Yoxar@...>
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 01:49:17 EDT
Subject: Name Questions: Zushe and Pesha

Question: How is the name Zushe spelled in Yiddish? I have seen it
spelled zayin-vav-samech-yud-alef. Is the name from the word "zees".
Also, has anyone heard of a girl's name spelled
pay-ayin-samech-yud-alef-how is it pronounced and what does it mean-is
it "Pesha"?


From: Ari Trachtenberg <trachten@...>
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 10:09:03 -0400
Subject: Re: Non-frum Jews and  Minyan

 >From: Benschar, Tal S. <tbenschar@...>
 >How easily people accuse others of sinas chinam, when in fact there are
 >serious halakhic issues involved.

I would argue that this is exactly the most sinister form of sinat
chinam ...  because it seems to have a legitimate justification.

The way the story was recalled (specifically the manner in which the
minyan-getter discounted unobservant Jews) certainly seems to qualify as
sinat chinam.

Ari Trachtenberg,                                      Boston University
http://people.bu.edu/trachten                    mailto:<trachten@...>


From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 07:03:11 +0100
Subject: Religious Non-Zionists

on 16/5/05 11:11 am, <FriedmanJ@...> (Jeanette Friedman) wrote:

> My uncle, Baruch Yerachmiel Yehoshua Rabinowich, the Admor of Munkacs,
> was made "ois rebbe" and now the chassidim say "Yemach Shmo" because he
> was a Zionist.  As far as I am concerned those who use that phrase
> regarding my uncle, well, the less I say what I think about that, the
> better.

There is, I hope apocryphal, story concerning Jeanette's grandfather,
the Munkacser Rebbe of the pre-WW2 era who was well known as being
vehemently opposed to Zionism. In this he vied with the Satmarer Rebbe
whom he considered to be too soft on what he considered to be a
dangerous heresy.  This rivalry is said to have resulted in his cursing
the latter that he would be punished by having no son to succeed him to
which the Satmarer responded with what he considered an even worse fate,
that the Munkacser would have a son but he would become a Zionist!  Both
curses were fulfilled.

Personally I find this sort of posturing rather puerile though the same
would apply to someone who refuses to attend a shul on the political
grounds that no prayer for the Israeli state is said. Can't we put our
political disagreements into perspective and not go out of our way to
insult those members of Torah Jewry with whom we may disagree.

Martin Stern


From: Harry Weiss <hjweiss@...>
Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 18:48:22 -0700
Subject: Re: Second day Yom Tov

>From: Alex Heppenheimer <aheppenh@...>
>Applying this to the case of the 8th day of Yom Tov, then, similar logic
>would apply: if it's not a proper time for wearing tefillin, then they
>can indeed be considered an ornament. (This would presumably require
>that the tefillin be put on without a berachah; perhaps Mr. Weiss can
>confirm whether this is indeed R' Rakeffet's practice.)

He did mention that it was without a bracha.


From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Fri, 20 May 2005 11:31:02 +0100
Subject: Re: Shir Hashirim time of reading

on 12/5/05 10:29 am, Sammy Finkelman <sammy.finkelman@...> wrote:
> Is there any occasiona when Shir Hashirim - or one of the other Megillos
> read on Chol Hamoed, or Shabbos if there is no Chol Hamoed is read at
> any other time than Shacharis before readin the Torah? How exact is the
> minhag?

I remember going to the Spanish and Portuguese Synagogue in NW London
many years ago for minchah on Shabbat Chol Hamoed Pesach and hearing
Shir Hashirim chanted aloud by boys from the Lady Montefiore College who
attended. As far as I could gather they were mainly of North African
origin and each one chanted one chapter according to the nusach of his
home town.

Martin Stern


From: David Maslow <maslowd@...>
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 07:48:22 -0400
Subject: Women and kaddish

In MJ 47:90, Martin Stern asks, in reference to women saying kaddish
regularly, "do any other members of mail-jewish know of any?"  

Let me add Silver Spring Maryland to the communities where there are
generally several women saying kaddish on a regular basis for the full

In the same number, Janice Gelb asks, with regard to a congregation allowing
a woman to say kaddish, "how could they stop her?"

I can think of four ways, some already mentioned:

Not having provision for a defined woman's area in the room used for weekday

The congregational rabbi ruling that women are forbidden to say kaddish.

Sarcastic remarks, social pressure, not answering amen, etc, from the men in

If the woman is the only person saying kaddish, simply rushing past the
kaddish points.

David E. Maslow


End of Volume 48 Issue 1