Volume 48 Number 83
                    Produced: Tue Jul  5  6:02:20 EDT 2005

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Kaddish at a minyan you're not davening with
         [Mike Gerver]
Kedusha - Emphasis
         [Mark Symons]
Second Job / Volunteering (3)
         [Jeanette Friedman, Janice Gelb, Nadine Bonner]
Women and Kiddush Levanah
         [Yael Levine]
Working for the Jewish press
Yitgadel Veyitkadesh
         [Haim Snyder]
Yom Kippur War  book


From: <MJGerver@...> (Mike Gerver)
Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 03:57:57 EDT
Subject: Kaddish at a minyan you're not davening with

Martin Stern, in v48n80, quotes me saying

> I was also told this. But once, when I was davening with the early
> minyan, I got there too late for the first kaddish (after "Rabbi
> Yishmael..."), and asked the rabbi if I could hang around at the
> beginning of the later minyan and say it then. I was told I could.

and then adds

      Why should Mike have done so since it is not necessary to say more
      than one kaddish a day and he had said at least one that morning?

Maybe that's the halacha (though I wonder whether that is only the
practice of the "real" Ashkenazic tradition that Martin belongs to, as
opposed to the "Polish" Ashkenazic tradition that most Ashkenazim come
from). But in any case, I think most aveilim feel, psychologically, that
the more (halachically sanctioned) kaddishes they say, the better.
Certainly most aveilim feel bad if they miss saying kaddish altogether
for mincha, even though they already said kaddish at shacharit that
morning. I certainly did. I think it's not a bad thing for aveilim to
feel this way, since, if nothing else, it gets them to make more effort
to daven every tefillah with a minyan. (I even managed to daven Friday
mincha with a minyan about half of the time when I was an avel, which is
far higher than my usual record for Friday mincha when I am not an avel.
Not, as I have assured Martin before, that I ever intentionally miss
davening mincha with a minyan.) And most aveilim will try to stick
around for a little learning after shacharit, or after mincha, to get in
an extra kaddish derabbanan. That's not a bad thing, either.

I am glad to hear, though, that an avel is only really required to say
one kaddish a day. The only day that I missed saying kaddish completely,
when I was an avel, was the day we made aliyah. There was no time for a
ma'ariv minyan before our flight left from Kennedy airport--we barely
made that flight, after packing all night and all morning, and missing
two El Al flights from Newark--and El Al was very fussy about not
allowing a minyan in the back of the plane for shacharit. And I couldn't
find a mincha minyan at Ben Gurion, after we landed late in the
afternoon, and couldn't go to Raanana right away since we had to go
through the aliyah paperwork at the airport. But I didn't feel too bad
about it, since, as someone said when I told him this story, "Ha-osek
be-mitzvah, patur mi-mitzvah," one who is engaged in one mitzvah is
exempt from other mitzvot.

Mike Gerver
Raanana, Israel


From: Mark Symons <msymons@...>
Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2005 22:59:55 +1000
Subject: Kedusha - Emphasis

There is an aspect of the format of Tefilla that occurs in most, if not
all, Ashkenaz minyanim that I have davened in, that bothers me. It is
that the sentences in Kedusha starting Kadosh, Baruch, Yimloch which are
actually the main part of the Kedusha, are rapidly glossed over and
gotten out of the way, whereas the sentences/paragraphs starting
Nekadesh, Az Bekol etc., which seemm to me to be just the introductions
to the main sentences, are concentrated on, eg saying slower, with
melody. This is both by the Kahal and the Chazan. It seems to me to be a
complete reversal of what should be the case.

The chazan will sing Nekadesh (or Naaritzach, or Nakdishcha) and reach
Vekara Zeh El Zeh Veamer, then the Kahal, instead of treating Kadosh
Kadosh Kadosh etc as befits the climax that it is, will quickly gabble
it off in a rush to get to Az Bekol, which they treat as the climax,
rather than the introduction that it is, dwelling on it, singing it more
slowly, and in the traditional tune, and the whole process is repeated
with Baruch Kevod Hashem Mimkomo, which they also then race through to
get out of the way to quickly get to Mimkomcha or Mimkomo, which is
treated as a climax. I'm not saying to race through the introductions,
in fact it is these introductions that there are a lot of tunes for,
especially Mimkomcha, but it seems to me to be missing the point when
Mimkomcha is sung with great spirit and enthusiasm, and then, the
sentence that should be the climax, Yimloch, becomes a virtual
non-event, being glossed over rapidly and lost.

A similar thing happens with the sentences Mi Chamocha and Hashem
Yimloch before Shemone Esreh. The Chazan sings Umalchuto ^ Veamru
chulam, then the Kahal gabble off Mi Chamocha in a hurry to reach what
they then treat as the Ikar, ie Malchutcha. Then the Chazan repeats
Malchutcha, singing it in the traditional melody, , and reaches Zeh E-li
Anu Veamru. Then the Kahal, instead of slowly reciting Hashem Yimloch
Leolam Vaed, giving that phrase, which is the climax, the attention and
emphasis it deserves, instead rattles it off to get to Vene'emar, which
they treat as the climax, singing it in the traditional nusach, and
which the chazan then repeats.

In my experience, the only exception to this is in the formal synagogues
where there is a choir, and the choir then does justice to the climax

Mark Symons
Melbourne, Australia.


From: <FriedmanJ@...> (Jeanette Friedman)
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 21:17:28 EDT
Subject: Re: Second Job / Volunteering

Ari you have it all wrong. This isn't about mowing MY lawn. It's about
providing services for free to someone ELSE who was paying a third
party.  That is unfair competition and That IS stealing, especially if
you know the only reason you are being printed is because you are free,
that it's a limited market to begin with, and that there are people
there who deserve to be printed and paid but aren't because the
publisher is cheap.

It's ok if a paper has a policy of paying NO ONE. For example, the
Holocaust survivors' newspaper doesn't pay anyone except the editor,
printer and post office.  Articles are solicited from the reader base
and NO ONE gets paid. There is no competition for column inches other
than quality and people are free to sell their stories elsewhere, before
or after the pieces are run. And you'd be surprised at the professional
writers who send in stuff because they want to reach the survivors and
their descendants. Most of the articles are about and by the subscribers
and are in terrible English which the editor rewrites. The editor also
acts as the art director and laison between the members of the board of
directors and webmaster--for a princely sum that doesn't cover the cost
of health insurance for two people. This work gets done for that kind of
money because people care about this work, especially when it comes to
the survivors. An income like that needs to be supplemented in other

So if you are a professional who has been writing for the weekly local
paper and getting $50 for your work, and suddenly you aren't given
assignments because people are working for free--well, I consider it a
different kettle of fish.

And BTW, it has nothing to do with technology and everything to do with

I think it was Elmore Leonard who wrote a story called "25 Cents a
Word."  If it wasn't Leonard, it might have been Larry McMurtry. But
that and "etoain shrdlu" a science fiction story about a linotype
machine, are the two best short stories I every read concerning the
profession of publishing. Especially the former.

I do not moonlight in a 711 or Welsh Farms, but if this is the new
trend, I may have no choice.


From: Janice Gelb <j_gelb@...>
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 19:14:13 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Second Job / Volunteering

<FriedmanJ@...> (Jeanette Friedman) wrote:
> In the real world, I make money writing, but in the Jewish media,
> where I began, it's a whole other story, and it is ONLY in the Jewish
> media we find this phenomenon....the writing the editors pick up
> stinks, and the editors complain, but as they say, IT'S FREE.

This phenomenon regarding the Jewish media has been extant since long
before the Internet and the advent of freely available writing.

In 1978 I got a job in Atlanta as a typesetting for a Jewish
newspaper. Although the starting salary was very low, I was assured that
after 2 months, my performance would be reviewed and if satisfactory,
the salary would be increased. Nearly 3 months went by before I could
get a meeting with the publisher, who said that he remembered their
promise but that they were not in great shape financially and I should
consider the difference in salary between their paper and a secular job
"tzedakah" for the Jewish community. I told him that I believed in
picking my own charities, thank you, and quit to find another job. I
wouldn't be surprised if this same mindset is true in other Jewish

-- Janice

From: Nadine Bonner <nadine.bonner@...>
Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 10:57:46 -0400
Subject: Second Job / Volunteering

While I sympathise with Jeanette, as a longtime editor/business manager
in the secular Jewish press, I must say that trying to make a living in
the Jewish press is building a house on sand.

Jewish newspapers are a dying breed. They no longer bind a community
together as they once did and most young people don't bother to read
them.  Advertisers know this, and therefore the papers are shrinking
week by week.  Most people don't realize this, but the number of pages
in a newspaper is not based on the amount of news, but on the amount of
advertising that makes it finiancially viable to print the
paper. Subscriptions cover some of the cost, but not very much.

When I was in the Jewish newspaper business (I've since moved more into
corporate writing), I rarely bought free lance pieces because I simply
couldn't afford them. Most newspapers subscribe to the JTA (Jewish
Telegraphic Agency), which supplies both national and Israeli news and a
variety of feature stories. If a good article was available for free, I
would use it. But had there been no free article, I would have used a
staff-written article or a JTA piece.

I personally do not believe in giving away my writing. I agree with the
great English writer Samuel Johnson, who said "Only a blockhead writes
for anything but money." But I don't really see that people who are
writing for free are taking parnosa away from free lancers. There is
simply no money in the Jewish press to pay free lancers. I might add
that the people working fulltime in the Jewish press are barely making a
living themselves.

Nadine Bonner


From: Yael Levine <ylevine@...>
Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2005 09:16:03 +0200
Subject: Women and Kiddush Levanah

I would like to point out that the Rabbi Yosef Hayyim of Bagdad, the Ben
Ish Hai, refers to the opinion of the Shelah concerning his opposion to
the recitation of Kiddush Levanah by women (see Rav Pe'alim, Part 4,
Jerusalem 1902, OH, Siman 34, 16d-18a). He concludes by writing that
this agrument was not mentioned by the Ari z"l, and there is no reason
according to his writings to prevent women from reciting Kiddush

Yael Levine


From: <meirman@...> (Meir)
Date: Mon, 04 Jul 2005 03:06:18 -0400
Subject: Working for the Jewish press

  At 03:59 PM 7/3/05, (Jeanette Friedman) wrote
>and it is ONLY in the Jewish media we find this phenomenon....the
>writing the editors pick up stinks, and the editors complain, but as
>they say, IT'S FREE.

Sort of related and I'm sure some of the people here know the answer.
The Jewish paper in this town has hired gentiles to actually interview
Jews etc. and write some of the articles in the paper.  Is this required
because of the law against religious discrimination in employment?  Does
it make a difference that this paper is privately owned, compared to
those owned by Federations, and Jewish magazines owned by Jewish
non-profits?  (I don't like it, and I would argue that being a Jew is a
requirement to do a good job writing for a Jewish paper, IF the Jews
themselves consistently did a better job.  But so far, I'm not convinced
they do.)

<meirman@...>  Baltimore, MD, USA


From: <Haim.Snyder@...> (Haim Snyder)
Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2005 11:54:48 +0300
Subject: Re: Yitgadel Veyitkadesh

Ira L. Jacobson asked "Can anyone explain the logic of claiming that the
two words are Hebrew rather than Aramaic?"

In the siddur "Azor Eliyahu" there is a whole section devoted to the
question of how to pronounce the first two words in the back of the
book, called Hashlamot (completions).  In there, one of the sources for
explaining why the kaddish being in Aramaic is Rashi's Sefer Hapardes,
paragraph 6 (this is the real question, not why are the first two words
Hebrew).  However, even this source agrees that the first two words are

As to why one should place a tzeirei instead of a patah under the
dalets, this, in my opinion, is merely a way of avoiding the confusion
as to which language is being spoken.  True, a patah under the dalet is
grammatically acceptable, but it leaves open the possibility that the
reciter will think he is speaking Aramaic.

See also the M"B 56-2 in which he says that one should say the dalet
with a tzeirei because it is Hebrew and not Targum (Aramaic).

Haim Shalom Snyder


From: .cp. <chips@...>
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 22:22:05 -0700
Subject: Yom Kippur War  book

Does anyone know if the book 'The Eve of Destruction' (by Blum) has been
repudiated to any significant extent?  I really have not found that much
about it on the 'net.


End of Volume 48 Issue 83