Volume 56 Number 17
                    Produced: Thu Dec 27 21:09:18 EST 2007

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

62 Israel related YouTube videos
         [Jacob Richman]
Anointing with Lotions on Shabbat
         [David Curwin]
Congratulations to the New Olim and 353 pictures posted online
         [Jacob Richman]
The equinoxes
         [Bernard Katz]
Hebrew Term for Sunrise (2)
         [Michael Frankel, Martin Stern]
Tithing Produce from Israel
         [Mark Steiner]
Wine and Shmittah
         [Steven Oppenheimer]
zemanim - a detail
         [Dr. Willaim Gewirtz]
Zmanim - time of candle lighting for shabbat
         [Aliza Berger-Cooper]


From: Jacob Richman <jrichman@...>
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 09:22:36 +0200
Subject: 62 Israel related YouTube videos

Hi Everyone!

I started a new section on my website related to good YouTube videos
about Israel including specific sections for Israeli technology and
a section for Israel music videos (oldies but goodies).
The address is:



From: David Curwin <tobyndave@...>
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:49:54 +0200
Subject: Anointing with Lotions on Shabbat

One of the prohibitions on Yom Kippur is anointing with lotions
(sicha). But isn't that prohibited on Shabbat as well?



From: Jacob Richman <jrichman@...>
Date: Fri, 28 Dec 2007 02:09:14 +0200
Subject: Congratulations to the New Olim and 353 pictures posted online

Hi Everyone!

On Thursday, December 27, I was at Ben-Gurion airport to greet the new
olim that made aliyah from North America to Israel.

Congratulations to the 191 olim that have returned to their
homeland. The excitement was everywhere and you knew that Jewish history
was unfolding before your very eyes.

This last flight of 2007 included 82 singles and 32 families with 25
children. The youngest oleh in the group is 3 months old and the oldest
olah is 96 years old. The flight also included 6 dogs and 2 cats.

I took 353 pictures of the exciting event and I posted them online at:

When the first page appears, press the F11 key to view the full length
of the pictures. To move from page to page, use the navigation buttons
on the bottom of the screen.

If I receive other pictures from people that were at the airport, I will
post them at: http://www.jr.co.il/pictures/israel/history/usa-aliyah.htm

May the aliyah from all over of the world grow and bring more Jews back
to their homeland, Eretz Yisrael.

Shabbat Shalom!


From: Bernard Katz <bkatz@...>
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 09:14:32 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: The equinoxes

> From: Bernard Raab <beraab@...>
> Yes, the astronomical truth is that the day and night are of equal
> length every place on Earth (at sea level) at the equinoxes , but these
> occur only two days every year when the sun is above the equator. But
> since the sun is never really at the equator but only crossing the
> equator, that is not a good day to be making precise measurements. Plus,
> from Wikipedia: "These effects (atmospheric refraction) together make
> the day about 14 minutes longer than the night at the equator, and
> longer still at sites toward the poles."  Ignoring the effects of
> atmospheric refraction, day and night are of equal length every day of
> the year, however, to an observer at the equator. 

I'm not sure that this is right. The word 'equinox' comes from the Latin
words 'aequus' (equal) and 'nox' (night), and this etymology may suggest
that the equinoxes occur when night and day are the same length. But
even ignoring the effect of atmospheric refraction, day and night are
not of equal length (even at sea level) on the day of an equinox, at
least not as defined in contemporary astronomy.

The equinoxes are the moments--not the days--when the centre of the Sun
appears to be directly above the equator. More precisely, the equinoxes
occur when the ecliptic plane (which is the apparent path of the Sun's
motion on the celestial sphere as seen from Earth) crosses the
equatorial plane (a great circle on the celestial sphere in the same
plane as the Earth's equator).

On the day of an equinox, the centre of the Sun will, in fact, spend the
same amount of time above and below the horizon, so that night and day
will be nearly the same length. But, in fact, the day will be longer
than the night at an equinox, for the Sun is a disc, not a single point
of light, and when the centre of the Sun is below the horizon, the upper
edge may be visible. Since the atmosphere refracts light, even when the
upper limb of the Sun is below the horizon, its rays reach over the
horizon to the ground, but this is a separate matter. In any case,
equality of day and night occurs a few days towards the winter side of
each equinox.

Bernard Katz


From: Michael Frankel <michaeljfrankel@...>
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 10:43:29 -0500
Subject: Re: Hebrew Term for Sunrise

> From: Jack Gross <jbgross@...>
>>> From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
>>> The word is hanetz, the heh not being the definite article but 
>>> indicating a hiphil formation from the root natsats.
>> yup, but it's henetz, not hanetz.
> Nope.
> hechel = (he) began, past tense
> hachel = begin!, imperative; begin, infinitive; beginning, gerund>

nope.  it's not good form, even a bit declasse, to quote oneself, but an
excuse here is that it includes an exchange with the distinguished dr.
steiner who is always worth reading.  see mail-jewish 38 #89
(http://www.ottmall.com/mj_ht_arch/v37/mj_v37i89.html:) where there is
an expanded discussion with some additional material.  so we've been
there and done that, and there is little reason to re-initialize the
thread.  (i assume by the way that martin stern's "hanetz" was meant as
a s'faradization of honetz. if he really meant to point it with a
patach, that would be a new suggestion which might require some moqor to
invest credibility).

Mechy Frankel

From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 21:31:29 +0000
Subject: Re: Hebrew Term for Sunrise

> I assume by the way that martin stern's "hanetz" was meant as a
> s'faradization of honetz. if he really meant to point it with a
> patach, that would be a new suggestion which might require some moqor
> to invest credibility.

Of course I meant it to be pointed with a kamats and not a patach.


From: Mark Steiner <marksa@...>
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 13:14:07 +0200
Subject: RE: Tithing Produce from Israel

> the Mishna, Rambam and SA all clearly pasken that outside of EY there
> is no obligation of tithing at all (in any year, not just shmitta).
> The Mishne LeMelech and RMF do required tithing

I believe that my posts on this question were published in the wrong
order; in my first post I mentioned the Rambam.

However, the above quote does not make sense to me for the following

The Mishneh Lamelech is a commentary on the Rambam, so there is no
dispute between them.  The Rambam rules that produce exported from EI
does not require tithing, and the Mishneh Lamelech restricts this to the
case where the "gmar melacha" was done abroad.  If the production and
packing was done in EY, then the produce already became "tevel" and we
do not find that the prohibition of eating "tevel" disappears just
because you shipped it to New York.  Now the Hazon Ish, for example, in
his book on Zeraim, regards this explanationi of the Rambam as simple
pshat and therefore, according to him you would clearly have to tithe
Israel produce in NY.  My recollection is that RMF also concurred with
this ruling.  Hence I reiterate that if two gedolim of this caliber read
the Rambam as the Mishneh Lamelech does, it would be prudent to tithe
the produce at least without making a beracha.  By the way, the Hazon
Ish (in Demai) adduces other arguments to prove that the Rambam in other
halachot regards the gemar melacha as the criterion.  So I don't think
that what the Mishneh Lamelech says is farfetched.


From: Steven Oppenheimer <steven.oppenheimer@...>
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 20:00:53 -0500
Subject: re: Wine and Shmittah

 <chips@...> wrote:

> I am looking at the label for a bottle of wine from Mount Tabor
> Estates in the Galilee, grapes of 2003. I see no mention of
> tithing. Am I supposed to spill out a portion of wine to cover the
> tithing?? Seems to me that the OK should mention that by their symbol.

The major Kashrut organizations do not rely on the heter mechirah.
However, there is wine produced in Israel under otherwise reliable
hashgacha that does rely on the heter mechirah.  This wine does not bear
the hashgacha of the major American hashgacha agencies but rather local
Israeli hashgacha.  This wine produced during shmittah and exported to
the US may have kedushat shevi'it, if you do not accept the heter
mechirah.  According to this view, you would then need to be sure to
consume all the wine and not just dispose of the left-over wine.

You should consult your LOR.

Steven Oppenheimer, DMD


From: <wgewirtz@...> (Dr. Willaim Gewirtz)
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 22:00:20 +0000
Subject: zemanim - a detail

I like Russell J Hendel's Event driven analogy.  It neatly summarizes a
book by Prof. Stern - Time and Process in Rabbinic Judaism.  However, it
does not follow that zemanim are a function of an individual's location
when surrounded by buildings that obscure the view or other individual
happenstance.  That is explicitly rejected by all Poskim that I have
seen commenting on this and is not comparable to the example of walking
4 amot.  Event-based rather than time-based definitions are the way
zemanim are specified by classical sources; I wonder if perhaps the
biblical violation of carrying in a public domain is more accurately
defined as an individual carrying while walking 4 normal steps to which
an amah is only a concrete/average approximation.


From: Aliza Berger-Cooper <alizadov@...>
Date: Wed, 26 Dec 2007 14:20:20 +0200
Subject: Zmanim - time of candle lighting for shabbat

I haven't been absorbing all of the discussion, so sorry if the answer
to this is obvious from what's been said previously. This is somewhat
timely. Why is it that the time of candle lighting (and shkiya, I
assume) for shabbat is not the earliest at the Shabbat closest to the
day that starts winter (Dec 21), but a couple of weeks earlier? I have
noticed this in the two locales I have lived in, New York and
Jerusalem. I assume some converse is true in the summer but I'm not 100%
sure of that. Maybe I pay less attention because of starting shabbat
early in the summer.


[This same question was asked by Joel Ehrlich about 8 years ago on the
list (24 Dec 1999), you can find the answers in volume 30 issue 50.
For those that want to do some of the graphing themselves, I found this
interesting URL on the subject: 


End of Volume 56 Issue 17