Volume 57 Number 13
Produced: Mon, 31 Aug 2009 07:31:59 EDT
Subjects Discussed In This Issue:
A Rule (4)
[Batya Medad Ira L. Jacobson Harry Weiss Hillel (Sabba) Markowitz]
Aggripas
[Martin Stern]
Inquiry
[Evan Rock]
Intermarriage and Niddah
[Martin Stern]
Line jumping at the kotel and anywhere else
[jeanette friedman]
Lines in Israel
[Daniel Wiener]
Not saying Tachanun (3)
[Ira L. Jacobson Martin Stern]
Taslich when there are no rivers or streams (3)
[S.Wise David Ziants Michael Poppers]
Yefat toar
[Martin Stern]
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From: Harry Weiss <hjweiss@...>
Date: Mon, Aug 24,2009 at 10:01 AM
Subject: A Rule
The Western Wall is not there as a tourist site. It is the remnant of the
retaining wall of the Temple Mount. It is the holiest place in Judaism.
Its primary purpose is for people to pray,. Those students were there not
to visit, but to do what is its regular purpose.
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From: Hillel (Sabba) Markowitz <sabbahillel@...>
Date: Mon, Aug 24,2009 at 12:01 PM
Subject: A Rule
> From: Marilyn Tomsk <jtomsky@...>
> No one has answered, who made up that rule that Jewish women/girls have to keep
> moving in enemy territory. This is crazy in a narrow packed crowd and a
> nuisance. When was this rule made, by whom and why?
Since
1. I have never heard of such a rule
2. I do not think that the Kosel, under the control of the IDF can be
labeled "enemy territory"
3. Marilyn Tomsk, as a female would also "have to keep moving" if
there were such a rule and the kosel could be considered "enemy
territory"
I would suspect that the child probably
totally misunderstood a comment that she may have heard without
actually paying proper attention.
--
Sabba - ' " - Hillel
Hillel (Sabba) Markowitz | Said the fox to the fish, "Join me ashore"
<SabbaHillel@...> | The fish are the Jews, Torah is our water
http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/7637/544/640/SabbaHillel.jpg
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From: Batya Medad <ybmedad@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 01:01 AM
Subject: A Rule
It's simple supply and demand. Many holy sites are overcrowded, Baruch
Hashem. The Ezrat Nashim in Kever Rachel is much, much more so. One
doesn't make reservations to doven in these places. Most months I don't
make it to the inner room in Kever Rachel. To my simple mind it seems
so goyish and idol worshipping to insist on touching. Maybe living in
Shiloh, where we still sense the shechina and fragrance of the ketoret
in the air, I just can't relate to G-d as so physical.
http://shilohmusings.blogspot.com/2009/08/fragrance-of-shechina.html I
publicize Women's Rosh Chodesh Prayers at Tel Shiloh, and each month the
women choose different locations in the beautiful Tel Shiloh.
Batya
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From: Ira L. Jacobson <laser@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 06:01 AM
Subject: A Rule
David Wachtel stated:
>In addition to the wide open plaza area, hundreds of feet of
>"inside" kotel space are available to the men.
There is also a good deal of inside space available for women, above
the men's area, all the way in. It has one-way glass as a mehitza,
so that at one grandson's bar mitzva, our women saw us clearly, while
we weren't even certain that they were there.
~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=
IRA L. JACOBSON
=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~
mailto:<laser@...>
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From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 10:01 AM
Subject: Aggripas
In the Parshat Shoftim (Deut. 17,14-20), we read the mitsvah of appointing a
king who shall be "mikerev achecha - from your brethren".
The Gemara (Sota 41b) recounts the famous occasion when King Aggripas who
was of Edomite descent (at least 4 generations removed from their original
conversion) read the Torah at the Hak'heil ceremony and burst into tears
when he reached this point to which the people shouted "Achinu ata, Achinu
ata - you are our brother, you are our brother". It is recorded that the
Sages did not approve.
Yet in Ki Teitsei (Deut. 23,8) we read that we should not abhor an Edomite
(and this probably applies even to one who had not converted) "ki achicha hu
- since he is your brother". Surely this is all the people meant when they
consoled King Aggripas, so why did the Sages disapprove?
Martin Stern
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From: Evan Rock <theevanrock@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 07:01 PM
Subject: Inquiry
In the light of the periodic reports of money laundering and other white collar
crimes within the Orthodox communities in the U.S.A. have there been any
responsas as to what the frum communities responses should be?
Are there questions and answers regarding cheating by students in Orthodox
universities?
Evan Rock
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From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 10:01 AM
Subject: Intermarriage and Niddah
On Thu, Aug 27,2009, Leah S. R. Gordon <leah@...> wrote:
> Please provide a source that the requirements/"sin" are the same
> for a Jewish woman with a Jewish man vs. a nonJewish man.
Alex Heppenheimer <aheppenh@...> has provided ample references to
which I can add very little.
Clearly where a Jewish man cohabits with a Jewish woman who is a niddah both
are subject to the punishment of karet min Hatorah [heavenly execution by
Torah law] though this would not apply to the woman if she were raped. The
general principle is that males and females are equal with regards to all
Torah prohibitions.
Where the male is not Jewish, it is equally obviously he is not liable to
karet which does not apply to non-Jews. However she, as a niddah, is still
liable. If one would argue that the principle of "vezimrat susim zirmatam"
(Ez. 23,20) would mean that we consider his acts as those of an animal, one
should bear in mind that bestiality is specifically prohibited to women
(Lev. 18,23) as well as men. Any 'punishment' applied to the animal is only
for the good of the human party so that people should not point it out and
say "that is the animal with whom so-and-so committed the offence".
Martin Stern
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From: jeanette friedman <FriedmanJ@...>
Date: Wed, Aug 26,2009 at 09:01 AM
Subject: Line jumping at the kotel and anywhere else
My granddaughter just came back from the kotel with photos of how "crowded"
it is. Looks just like it has since the Israelis rebuilt the plaza decades
ago. (It obviously doesn't matter that Herod the idolator and murderer of
his own children built it.)
In any event, Is it right for anyone to be a line jumper anywhere? In New
York and New Jersey, it can get you killed (try it on an unemployment line,
an ATM, bus line or VIP club line). In Israel, you expect people to behave
like "menschen." But you know what Mel Brooks says about expectations:
"Hope for the best, expect the worst," (from The 12 Chairs (1970).
BTW, I just love the idea of "prayer by proxy" at the Kotel. Can I send
someone else to shul for me on Yom Kippur? After all, I really don't want to
stand through a 2-hour amida amid the stink of smelling salts when I am
fasting and have a headache--maybe I can get a special dispensation so I can
stay home in bed because someone else is "confessing" and asking mechila for
me?
jeanette friedman
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From: Daniel Wiener <ppman@...>
Date: Mon, Aug 31,2009 at 03:01 AM
Subject: Lines in Israel
i am living here, b'h, for 20 years. i often shop and rarely have people pushing
to get ahead in lines. i rather think that this is a VERY poor excuse not to
live here. the whole land is kadosh and it disturbs me that people litter.
however, i gently correct them if possible and continue living. there are many
other countries where all of these negative habits exist. we must look at the
positive things. i live in ir hakodesh for 20 years. it still continues to
excite me.
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From: Ira L. Jacobson <laser@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 06:01 AM
Subject: Not saying Tachanun
Shmuel Himelstein stated:
> From what I recollect, a certain Chassidic custom is not to say
> Tachanun on the Yohrzeit of any great Rav. To facilitate matters, I
> once saw a yearly calendar which listed the Yohrzeits of hundreds
> of great rabbis - at least one for each day of the Hebrew year.
> Thus there was never a day upon which Tachanun should be said.
It is hard to speak of all Hasidic groups in one breath. But in the
Vizhnitz shul in my neighborhood, IIRC they omit Tahanun on the
yahrzeits of their rebbes, on those of a handful of Hasidic giants
(Best, Maggid of Mezerich, Moshe Rabbenu, etc.) and on the yahrzeit
of the rebbe of any particular hassid who happens to be davening
there that particular morning. They recognize specifically the great
duty to recite tahanun whenever there is no compelling reason not to.
~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=
IRA L. JACOBSON
=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~
mailto:<laser@...>
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From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 06:01 AM
Subject: Not saying Tachanun
On Wed, Aug 26,2009, Shmuel Himelstein <himels@...> wrote:
> From what I recollect, a certain Chassidic custom is not to say Tachanun on
> the Yohrzeit of any great Rav. To facilitate matters, I once saw a yearly
> calendar which listed the Yohrzeits of hundreds of great rabbis - at least
> one for each day of the Hebrew year. Thus there was never a day upon which
> Tachanun should be said.
This particular 'custom' is decried by the (Chassidic) Sefer "Minhag Yisrael
Torah" though he concedes that each group of Chassidim might be justified in
omitting tachanun on the yahrzeits of Rebbes of the dynasty to whom they
adhere.
Martin Stern
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From: Orrin Tilevitz <tilevitzo@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 12:01 PM
Subject: Not Saying Tachanun
<From what I recollect, a certain Chassidic custom is not to say Tachanun on
the Yohrzeit of any great Rav. To facilitate matters, I once saw a yearly
calendar which listed the Yohrzeits of hundreds of great rabbis - at least
one for each day of the Hebrew year. Thus there was never a day upon which
Tachanun should be said.>
I heard this too, but as part of a joke. The punch line is that a gabbai gets up one day in shul and announces "I'm sorry to say that we'll have to say Tachanun today; nobody died." Whereupon someone replied, "Nobody died? It's a yom tov, no Tachanun!"
And then there's a little essay I wrote showing that on a majority of days in the year, no Tachanun is said at at least one prayer; so that applying the principle of rubo hayom kekulo [a part of the day is considered a whole day] and extending the notion of yatza rov hachodesh besimcha [most of the month is festive, so we don't say Tachanun at all in Nisan] to yatza rov hashana besimcha [most of the year is festive], we should never say Tachanun at all. But the essay was Purim Torah. Or so I thought.
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From: S.Wise <Smwise3@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 12:01 AM
Subject: Taslich when there are no rivers or streams
Joseph Mosseri writes:
> I believe the key factor is standing by any body of running water and a
> hose in a pool suits the job.
I thought the purpose was to find a body of water that had fish in it. I
don't quite understand how anyone would consider a pool and a hose adequate.
Tashlich is a minhag, and as such, there appears to be great flexibility
when to say it. So, in Brooklyn, where I live, there are great crowds that
recite Tashlich at any legitimate body of water all during aseres y'mai
teshuva even up to Hoshanah Rabbah. Given how late many shuls finish davening
on Rosh Hashanah, there just isn't enough time even if there were a body of
water in walking distance.
S.Wise
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From: David Ziants <dziants@...>
Date: Sun, Aug 30,2009 at 07:01 PM
Subject: Taslich when there are no rivers or streams
Although I never asked on this specific case, generally the response of
the Rabbannim [Rabbis] in the neighbourhood where I live of minhag
[Jewish custom] related issues is that there is no (real) "halacha"
[strict law]. I think, what they mean by this is that one should go
along with the flow of what is done within the shul communities and what
the family wants, etc. That doesn't mean that we do not hear shiurim
[lectures] on the merits of doing tashlich in different ways (although I
cannot remember the last time I heard such a shiur), but at the end of
the day, it doesn't really matter.
When I lived in the upper part of the city, a lot of people when to
outside the Mikve in Rechov HaNachalim ["Streams/Valleys Street"] and I
tried going there as well. If I was short of time before Mincha, I
stopped at the "b'raicha" [city water cistern]. Sometimes I did it
privately from my kitchen window (then I lived on the top floor) from
which one could see, on a clear day, the Dead Sea ~20km in the distance
. There was a year I knew I would be in Tel Aviv a few days after Rosh
HaShanna, so I said it over looking the Ayalon [a river that runs
through Tel Aviv].
Now we live on a ground floor apartment in a different neighbourhood,
the options are different. Last year, I did it with one of the shul
communities, I am a member of (with my family), overlooking the dead
sea in the distance.
This does not mean we cannot discuss the merits of the various options.
For example, one could laugh about the techum issue [not walking a
certain distance outside city limits on Shabbat and Yom-Tov - so may be
one should not throw ones sins so far <laugh>] to the Dead Sea.
David Ziants
Ma'aleh Adumim, Israel
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From: Michael Poppers <MPoppers@...>
Date: Thu, Aug 27,2009 at 11:01 PM
Subject: Taslich when there are no rivers or streams
In M-J V57#11, David Ziants wrote:
> In my small city of Ma'aleh Adumim, Israel, there are no rivers or
streams.
> The following options of doing Taslich (Rosh HaShanna prayer that is
customarily said next to running stream] here, seem to be available.... <
AFAIK (As far as I know), Tashlich is a custom which involves a community
walking to a body of water (for details, see DM 583:2, excerpted by RMA in
his notes to SA OC 583). David, have you asked your LOR whether you need
to worry about saying Tashlich on Rosh haShanah (as opposed, say, to
driving to a relevant body of water after Rosh haShanah) when there is no
body of water to walk to? Thanks.
All the best from
--Michael Poppers via RIM pager
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From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Fri, Aug 28,2009 at 10:01 AM
Subject: Yefat toar
A thought struck me regarding the Yefat toar [a non-Jewish woman captured in
battle to whom her Jewish captor is attracted] at the beginning of Ki
Teitsei (Deut. 21, 10-14).
Since she is converted and then marries the captor, does this mean that a
cohen may be excluded from this halachah.
Can anyone shed light on this?
Martin Stern
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End of Volume 57 Issue 13