Volume 6 Number 33

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Automatic Lights on Shabbat
         [Robert Gordon]
B'rachah on Procreation (2)
         [Nachum Issur Babkoff, Michael Block]
Book Question
         [Elaine Saklad]
         [Charles Abzug]
Horaat Shaah
         [Bruce Klein]
In Vitro Fertilization
         [Bob Werman]
More on Worcestershire sauce
         [Gerald Sacks]
Reb Moshe etc.
         [Yosef Bechhofer]
Strange Names for Jewish Things
         [Naomi G. Cohen]


From: <U08383@...> (Robert Gordon)
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1993 13:37:11 CST
Subject: Automatic Lights on Shabbat

The question was asked recently how one should behave if one
inadvertantly turns on a light on shabbat by engaging the lock in a
bathroom stall.  A similar problem actually occurred to me (in Japan of
all places) when I interupted a light beam which was part of a circuit
controling a faucet.  If I were to allow the light to resume its
original path the water would have been turned on.  In fact I did not
spend all shabbat standing still, so I guess I was somech on the kula
regarding unintentional consequences of behavior.  Robert Gordon


From: <babkoff@...> (Nachum Issur Babkoff)
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 93 18:27:51 +0200
Subject: Re: B'rachah on Procreation

May I add to Aryeh Frimmers comments, that a woman who is no longer
able to concieve, and is married to an impotent; may sue for divorce
on the sole basis that she is being denied sexual satisfaction.
                             Nachum Issur Babkoff

From: <mcb@...> (Michael Block)
Date: Tue, 2 Feb 93 11:00 EST
Subject: Re: B'rachah on Procreation

Aryeh Frimer write:
> even if she is sterile, pregnant etc. I reiterate my basic argument,
> that the fact that there is not even a hint of procreation in the Sheva
> Brachot - which is supposed to sum up the message to the Jewish Bride
> and Groom - that procreation is NOT the CENTRAL element in marriage.

A quick check of an Artscroll Siddur, bracha gimal (#3):

asher yatzar et ha'adam b'tzalmo
	"who fashioned the Man in His image"
	Refers to human wisdom intelligence and free will

b'tzelem d'moot(h) tavnit(h)o
	"in the image of his likeness"
	Thanking Gd for providing man with a body that serves as host
	to the soul and as a tool for the performance of commandments.

v'hit(h)kin lo mimenu - binyan ahdey ahd
	"and prepared for him, from himself"
	Eve was created from Adam himself, i.e., from a part of Adam's
	"- a building for eternity."
	Eve is called a building (Gen 2:22) following the verse that
	narrates her creation (Rashi).  The resultant human couple was
	to reproduce and populate the earth forever (Avodas Yisrael).

In him commentary on the word 'vaYiven' (And He built) in Gen 2:22 Rashi
uses 'binyan' (a building) describing the creation of woman specifically
with reference to her ability to carry children.

This is at least a strong hint of procreation.  However I will not argue
that Gila (mirth), rina (joyous song), ditza (pleasure) v'Cheva (delight)
Ahava (love) v'Achva (brotherhood) v'Shalom (peace) v'Reut (companionship)
are more central.


From: Elaine Saklad <EFS@...>
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 93 11:10:57 -0500
Subject: Book Question

I found a book in a book store last weekend that I hadn't seen before.
It's called 'Yevarech es Hanearim' (He'll bless the children), and it's
a compilation of halachos of pregnancy, childbirth, and children.  As
I'm in my seventh month of pregnancy, with 2 kids, it looked
interesting.  It's by Rabbi Shlomo Cohen, and so far looks pretty good.
One thing that I like about it is that it has sources for most of the
halachos that he cites, although I haven't heard of some of the books he
quotes.  A problem that I find with many halacha books is that there are
a lot of chumras, or 'non-mainstream' halachos.  Realizing that all
questions should be asked to one's one rav, has anyone heard of this
rabbi or this book?  I'd appreciate any comments.  Thanks.

Elaine Saklad


From: <cabzug@...> (Charles Abzug)
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 93 03:20:31 -0500
Subject: Chuppah

With respect to several comments regarding the "Chuppah" part of the 
wedding, especially Aryeh Frimer's comment, it should be mentioned that 
there arre exactly two parts to a wedding ceremony.  The first part is
when the groom gives to his bride the ring and says "Harey at mekudeshet
  .  .  .", and the second is when he takes her into the privacy of the 
room.  Both acts must be performed in the presence of legal witnesses to
make the wedding.  If they did the actions WITHOUT ANY BROCHOS whatsoever,
it doesn't matter, they are married anyway.  While Aryeh is correct in 
pointing out that the "Chuppah" is valid even if the bride is on the 
pill or is pregnant or nursing or postmenopausal, nevertheless it must
be pointed out that no lesser a posek than the Rambam holds that if
she is a Niddah (a menstruant who has not yet dunked in the Mikveh), then
the Nisuin (i.e., the Chuppah) is NOT VALID.  Specifically, what is 
required is a "Chuppah" that is ra'ui l'bi'ah, i.e., an private interlude
in which it is POSSIBLE (including hallachically permissible) to have
sexual relations, although it is not required that they have sexual
relations at that time.  In fact, the Rambam points out that before 
Matan Torah that is what a wedding was  -  husband took wife into his
house to live with him.

					Charles Abzug


From: <bjk@...> (Bruce Klein)
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 93 18:41:28 -0500
Subject: Horaat Shaah

In MJ #26, Steve Ehrlich mentioned that the Conservative heter to drive
on Shabbat is based on the principle of Horaat Shaah (decree
for a specific time) and asked about other examples of this principle.
The most famous one I can remember is part of a well know responsa
of Rav Baruch Ber Leibowitz concerning secular education.
Rav Baruch Ber comes down firmly against secular education but is
clearly troubled by the position of Rav Shimshon Raphael Hirsch whose
views allowing/encouraging secular education (for the right reasons etc.)
were well known.  Rav Baruch Ber, while recognizing Rav
Hirsch's stature (he refers to him as the Tzaddik from Frankfurt) comes
to the conclusion that Rav Hirsch's views are in the realm of a Horaat
Shaah.  That is, given the intellectual and social fabric of Germany
at that time, it was necessary for Rav Hirsch to rule as he did on secular
education but this should not be taken as a general psak for all places
and all times.

Bruce Klein 


From: <RWERMAN@...> (Bob Werman)
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 93 03:49:01 -0500
Subject: In Vitro Fertilization

Dr. Isaac Balbin writes:

>Without getting into this too much, another interesting example is that
>of Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach Shlita and his `lack of view' on IVF.  I
>know that when he sees the Doctors involved in this at Shaa-rei Tzeddek
>Hospital, he literally avoids them. Aspects of IVF are also not clear in

I have heard that the Ga'on, Rav Shin-Zayin, has another reason for
avoiding psika on In Vitro Fertilization, which may not contradict the
reason given by Dr. Balbin.

He has no male grandchildren and feels too emotionally involved to
handle the subject matter of birth and abortion.

And another aside, to match Dr. Balbin's: Rav Levi-YitzHak Halpern, a
noted posek here who specializes in the problems of medicine and of
Shabbat and gives a medical halachic shi'ur in Yerushalayim, has no
problems with IVF [if the father is the father] and even with thinning
of embryos despite coming down strongly on Rav Moshe's side in the
maHloches on rodef in abortion, and despite being a strong advocate of
fetal "rights."

__Bob Werman    <rwerman@...>    rwerman@vms.huji.ac.il


From: Gerald Sacks <sacks@...>
Date: Tue, 2 Feb 93 09:11:57 -0500
Subject: More on Worcestershire sauce

Someone inquired offline about my statement in Vol 6 No 20 about fish
in Worcestershire sauce.  I found the source that I had based it on.
>From KosherGram, Vol. V No. 1 (Feb 1984):


are now OU certified.

The WORCESTERSHIRE SAUCE contains a significant amount (5%) of anchovies,
and should not be used with meat.  New labels will state "OU FISH".

The two steak sauces do not contain any fish.

and A&P brands, contain only a very minute amount of anchovies, and
according to many Poskim may therefore be used with meat; consult your Rav.


From: <YOSEF_BECHHOFER@...> (Yosef Bechhofer)
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 93 18:49:59 -0500
Subject: Reb Moshe etc.

        I believe that my point is in fact somewhat clarified by
Isaac's relating the episode with Reb Moshe - in fact, it is impossible
to ascertain Reb Moshe's rationale from the statement attributed to
him! He simply sanctioned precedent set by recognized Talmidei
Chachamim, perhaps based on the Chazon Ish :-).
        I agree that this has nothing to do with da'as Torah - on the
contrary, halachically the Chazon Ish seems the most solid opinion.


From: Naomi G. Cohen <RVOLF01@...>
Date: Wed, 03 Feb 93 23:15:37 IST
Subject: Re: Strange Names for Jewish Things

On the subject of strange names for Jewish things:

Several years ago we visited Rumania, including a village called SATU
MARU.  I bought a souvenir there with that written on it, and I was/am
convinced that it comes from the Satmar's home town (so others around me
who should have known thought so)

In any event the synagogue at which the Chief Rabbi of England worships
is called: St. John's Wood, after the street upon which it is situated;
and it doesn't seem to bother anyone but me.

An autobiographical tidbit. Many years ago my cousin's daughter was
married in Paris. When said cousin visited by late father of blessed
memory he expresse d surprise that no congratulations were sent. My
father said: How can you expec t me to congratulate you on a church
wedding! It turned out that it was actuall y a synagogue wedding, but
the synagogue was located on Rue de Saint something or other.  



End of Volume 6 Issue 33