Volume 12 Number 82
                       Produced: Mon Apr 25 18:50:39 1994

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Bacon in the time of Moshiach (3)
         [Rabbi Freundel, Yacov Barber , Yitzchok Adlerstein]
Diamonds, BT books
         [Freda B. Birnbaum]
         [Eli Turkel]
Hester Panim
         [Jeff Woolf]
         [Robert Klapper]
Row Away from the Rocks
         [Art Kamlet]
Shavous and the International Date Line
         [Chaim Schild]
Stitches on Shabbat
         [Rabbi Freundel]
Teaching Torah to non-Jews
         [Anthony Fiorino]
Video Camera on Shabbos
         [Moshe Goldberg]
Watching TV, Videos, and Dating during Sefiras Haomer
         [Yonah Wolf]
Yom Tov Sheini
         [Sam Gamoran]
Yom Tov Sheni
         [Yacov Barber]


From: <dialectic@...> (Rabbi Freundel)
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 02:10:11 EDT
Subject: Re: Bacon in the time of Moshiach

In response to Herb Taragin's question about bacon and ham being part of
our meals in the Messianic era. the earliest sources that mention it are
all medieval and include Sefer Or Yikras end of Parshat Shmini, Chayim
ibn Atar, ibid., Radbaz, Responsa sect 2, #828 and Rabbenu Bechaya also
at the end of Shmini. The latter suggests that this is an alternate
reading that some had in the midrash Rabbah at this point though our
texts do not support such a reading. Most assume that the pig will
change physiologically and begin chewing its cud. I can hear the bacon
sizzling now.

From: <barbery@...> (Yacov Barber )
Date: Mon, Apr 25 23:27:51 1994
Subject: Bacon in the time of Moshiach

>Where is the chazal that says Bimharah biyomainu after Moshiach comes,
>that Chazir will become mootar? Where is the chazal and what is the
>significance of that maamar?? Thank You
 The expression of Chazal is "Why is it called 'chazir'?  Because G-d will
one day restore it to Israel."It is brought in the Asoroh Mamoros of the
Rama Mipano mamar choker din sect. 4  ch. 13. It is also found in Yalkut
Reuveni in parshas Shemini ch. 23,2. And in the Orah Chaim Hakodesh on the
same posuk. However it is not found in any Medrash that we have today.
 The Radvaz sect.2 ch. 828 writes that this Medrash cannot be understood
literally since the Torah tells us that we are prohibited to add or
substract from the mitzvos of the Torah. He therefore explains that in the
era of Moshiach we will eat mishmanim the fats of meat and we will consider
it as if we were permitted to eat chazir.
                            Yacov Barber 
South Caulfield Hebrew Congregation
Phone: +613 576 9225
Fax: +613 528 5980

From: Yitzchok Adlerstein <ny000594@...>
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 94 00:08:25 -0800
Subject: Bacon in the time of Moshiach

Rabbi Moshe Taragin asked for the source of the Chazal that the Chazir 
will become permissible in the days of Moshiach.  The only one I recall 
(which doesn't mean much) is the Ohr HaChaim on Vayikra (11:3)

The significance is likely Kabbalistic, along the lines hinted at in
Nefesh HaChaim, that even evil is given kiyum by HKBH, and therefore has
some aspect of Divinity, although thoroughly masked in our world by
kelipos.  (If you know what that all means, please explain it to this

We do know who <perverted> the concept.  Shabbtai Zvi reportedly took a
piece of old Porky on Tisha B'av, and ate it, preceding this with a
beracha "Matir Issurim (sic - NOT Assurim)." His implication was that
he, Shabbtai, had already ushered in the time of the liberation of the
nitzotzos of kedusha even from the previously halachically forbidden.

Rabbi Yitzchok Adlerstein
Yeshiva of LA


From: Freda B. Birnbaum <FBBIRNBAUM@...>
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 11:53:34 -0400
Subject: Diamonds, BT books

In V12N79, Shmuel Weidberg quotes the "BT books" re women davening:

>As far as the philosophy behind it the Baal Teshuvah books discuss it
>and say something like: Women are like diamonds and men are like the
>rings without the diamonds. Diamonds are complete on their own whereas
>rings need to be joined. etc. Look in your local BT book for a more
>coherent explanation.

Ah, but diamonds in the rough still need some cutting and polishing!
(I don't get it at all about rings needing to be joined, but then, I 
don't read BT books very much... tho I prefer books to diamonds, when
I come home from the bookstore with a big load of them, to the cry of
"Where will we PUT them?!", I just say, would you rather have a wife
who buys seforim or a wife who buys fur coats? and we find room...
I digress!)

Freda Birnbaum, <fbbirnbaum@...>
"Call on God, but row away from the rocks"


From: <turkel@...> (Eli Turkel)
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 08:50:30 +0300
Subject: Gebrokts

     A friend of mine grew up on the Lower East Side and became friendly
with Rav Moshe Feinstein. Rav Moshe invited him several times for seder
but he always turned down the invitation because Rav Moshe ate gebrokts
but he was too embarassed to give his real reason. Rav Moshe finally
suspected what was happening and asked him point blank if the reason was
because of gebrokts.  My friend said yes and then Rav Moshe replied that
he should have said so a long time ago. He called over 2 boys from the
yeshiva and annulled his vow (hatarat nedarim) and said now you can come
to my seder, which he did.

     Also many people who do not eat gebrokts do eat it on the 8th day
of Pesach. Since they use the same dishes the next Pesach (under 1 year)
they are not worried that the dishes became chametz. I assume that Rav
Wosner who said that one should be careful with dishes was referring to
Israel where there is no such custom (only 7 days to Pesach).



From: Jeff Woolf <F12043@...>
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 14:45:51 -0400
Subject: Re: Hester Panim

In reference to the comment that Jews are incapable of holding on to
Israel I'd simply like to add: What does the writer think we are doing
right now with blood?...And, BTW, Hester Panim doesn't mean NO Divine
Providence, it means Hidden Providence and more dependence on the
natural order. If there were no Divine Providence during the past 2,000
years of Hester Panim, the writer would not be here to complain.
                 Jeffrey Woolf


From: <rklapper@...> (Robert Klapper)
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 05:20:07 -0400
Subject: Re: Pets

Howard Jachter published an article on the subject in the RJJ Journal
last year.


From: <ask@...> (Art Kamlet)
Date: 24 Apr 1994  21:09 EDT
Subject: Row Away from the Rocks

>Freda Birnbaum <fbbirnbaum@...> writes:
>"Call on God, but row away from the rocks"

I like this.  It reminds me of the story of the poor fellow who is
in a great flood, and as the waters rise, he climbs to the roof and
says "G-d will save me."   People come by in a 4-wheel, then in boat,
then in a helicopter, and each time he says, "No, G-d will save me."
Finally the waters rise above the roof and he drowns, and meets G-d
and says, "Why didn't you save me?"   And G-d says, "First I sent a
4-wheel, then a boat, then a helicopter ..."

The lesson I get from this is we should trust in G-d but should
take matters into our own hands.

We cannot say G-d will cure a sick child  so we need do nothing; we
must take into our own hands the responsibility to find doctors and
medicine.   We cannot say G-d will protect us against our enemies
so we need not defend ourselves; we must take defense into our own

I recently saw "Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat"
a rock musical by Sir Andrew Lloyd Webber.  And while they gloss
over the fact that Joseph stays in jail for two years after the
butler is released, the rabbis teach that the 2 years were
punishment.  Because Joseph took matters into his own hands, we are
told,  because he tried to "row away from the rocks" he was punished
with another two years in prison.

Or take the case of poor Uzah, who was accompanying the Ark on its
journey to the City of David, and noticed that the oxen were
shaking the ark, so he reached out to keep the ark from falling, in
effect he took matters into his own hands, and G-d killed him.

Or look at the treatment given to Eve for taking matters into her
own hands and even Building a Fence around the Torah:  When the
serpent asks what are the rules for the fruit of the tree, Eve not
only says she cannot eat of the fruit, she builds a Fence and says
And we can't even touch it.   For taking matters into her own hands
by building a Fence, we are told, she is punished.

So my difficulty, which I ask for help to resolve, is that I truly
believe Freda's "Call on God, but row away from the rocks"  but
cannot align that with the treatment of Joseph or Uzah or Eve.

Art Kamlet   AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus   <ask@...>


From: SCHILD%<GAIA@...> (Chaim Schild)
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 08:41:37 -0400
Subject: Shavous and the International Date Line

Perhaps this dilemma has been dealt with before but:

Given that Shavous is established by the counting of the Omer and this
counting is a private/personnel obligation (as opposed to Shabbas, or
Shemitta) what if someone goes across the international dateline during
sefirah. Does this person celebrate Shavous a day earlier or later if
they do not return before Yom Tov (and can crossing back fix things) ???



From: <dialectic@...> (Rabbi Freundel)
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 94 02:09:58 EDT
Subject: Re: Stitches on Shabbat

I was amazed and shocked by Michah Berger's story of not being sent to
receive stitches on Shabbat. This as far as I understand it is a Makah
shel Challel (an internal injury) which requires immediate attention on
Shabbat (see Shulchan Aruch Orach Chayim 328 and Rambam Hilchot Shabbat
ch. 2) given the loss of blood and possibility of infection. Not only
shouldn't the Rabbi have prevented you he should have driven you to the
Dr. himself.


From: Anthony Fiorino <fiorino@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 14:32:28 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Teaching Torah to non-Jews

The other article on this topic that I and Joel Sisenwine else mentioned is:

R. S. Borenstein, "Teaching Torah to Non-Jews." J. Halacha & Contemporary
Society 26, Fall 1993. pp 58-76.

The article in R. Bleich's third volume of _Contemporary Halakhic
Problems_ is a reprint of his 1980 _Tradition_ article, as Freda

[Aryeh Blaut <ny000592@...> also sent in the reference to R
Borenstein's article. Mod.]


From: <vamosh@...> (Moshe Goldberg)
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 1994 03:47:14 -0400
Subject: Re: Video Camera on Shabbos

In v12n70, Shmuel Weidberg writes:
> I believe that there is no problem walking uner a video camera on Shabbos.

The latest issue of Techumin, vol 14, has an article by Rabbi Yisrael
Rozen, "Closed Circuit Television on Shabbat," and it quotes an exchange
of letters about this topic. Rav Moshe Feinstein writes as follows about
the question of passing before a camera at the entrance to a building:

"Since this is writing that is not permanent [eino mitkayem], and in
fact is even less than that [v'afilu adif], this is at most a Rabbinic
prohibition, and since anyone passing by is at most causing the effect
inadvertently [psik reisha d'lo ichpat lei], it is permitted. There is
also no prohibition for the one who set up the camera, since this is
done before Shabbat."

       Moshe Goldberg


From: Yonah Wolf <wolf28@...>
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 10:25:50 -0400
Subject: Watching TV, Videos, and Dating during Sefiras Haomer

	With regards to sefirah, there are many tshuvos available on
listening to music, which is a common practice among all jews. But I
have yet to find a Prominent Rav who has written a tshuva regarding
television and sefirah. It would seem to me that news programs would be
okay, but what about documentaries? I also do not go to movies during
sefirah, what about watching a video? I'd like to know if it is
permissble to go on a date as well during sefirah? (it is a form of

Yonah Wolf                           If I am not for myself then who     
Polytechnic University Brooklyn      be for me? Yet if I am all for myself
(718)859-2235                        then what am I? if not now, when?- 
<wolf28@...>                       Hillel the Elder (Avot ch.1)

[Have you found a Prominent Rav who has written a tshuva permitting
watching television not during sefirah? 1/2 :-). I strongly suspect that
many of the Poskim who were asked "Is is permissable to watch movies
during sefira?" who answered "No." would have given the same answer if
you left out the sefira part. Mod.]


From: gamoran%<milcse@...> (Sam Gamoran)
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 08:10:15 -0400
Subject: Re: Yom Tov Sheini

My grandfather was the director of Jewish Education for the Reform
Movement in Cincinnati/New York from 1925-1960.  He was a minority voice
in their decision to 'abolish' Yom Tov Sheini.

His attitude was, "If the Jews in Galus can find a little reason to
rejoice on a Yom Tov they deserve the two days of simcha."


From: <barbery@...> (Yacov Barber)
Date: Sun, Apr 24 23:29:42 1994
Subject: Yom Tov Sheni

>I haven't seen them recently, so I don't remeber exactly where it is.

The Chacham Tzvi is in siman 167 and the Alter Rebbe is in o.c. siman 496
s.11 and o.c. madura basrasiman 1 s. 8
                                         Yacov Barber
South Caulfield Hebrew Congregation
Phone: +613 576 9225
Fax: +613 528 5980


End of Volume 12 Issue 82