Volume 12 Number 83
                       Produced: Mon Apr 25 19:59:28 1994

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Arthur Roth, Shevas, and Computers (somewhat related topics)
         [Mechy Frankel]
Fetal Reduction
         [Ari Kurtz]
Florence, Italy
         [Rick Turkel]
         [Joshua Sharf]
New Jewish List in Boston
         [Simon /Simcha/ Streltsov]
Primers on Judaism (2)
         [Leonard Oppenheimer +1 908 615 5071, Aryeh Frimer]
         [Nathan Katz]


From: Mechy Frankel <frankel@...>
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 1994 18:20:49 -0400
Subject: Arthur Roth, Shevas, and Computers (somewhat related topics)

Arthur Roth was kind enough to e-mail me a pre-print (?) of his mj
submission responding to my earlier (Vol 12 #51) posting, so I'm taking
the opportunity to re-respond to his remarks in a timely fashion.

1. Responding to his challenge to exhibit a prefixed bais and other
prefixes operating on the same root word with differing results,
consider the words"lichtove" (Devarim 31/24) and "bechesove" (Tehilim
87/7). The sheva in the former is unambiguously nach, while the latter
appears to be another sheva merachef situation. Additionally consider
the lamed prefix of "letsvoh" (Bemidbar 4/23) (here merachef - or na -
under the tsadi) as compared to a more frequent effect of a lamed prefix
producing a sheva nach (as in "lichtove", lishtose", "lishpoche") - at
least in the verb forms. I also came across the pair "keshechav"
(Melochim"1 1/21) and "lishkav" (Beraishis 39/10) illustrating
episodically different functional results of ostensibly similar-type
prefixes.  Incidentally, I could find no systematic difference in the
operation of a prefixed bais+chirik and the other prefixes in simple
noun/prepositional forms, e.g. begevul (Bemidbar 33/44) "=" legevul
(Bemidbar 21/15). (Though I don't mean to imply I conducted any kind of
systematic search. These are random examples I happened across while
leafing cursorily through my Ben-Saone Concordance and Koren Tanach
(which BTW I'm nowhere near enamoured of as I used to be, but that's a
topic, perhaps, for another day) after receiving Arthur's preprint. i.e.
a very sparse sampling. What I would really like is a computerized
search capability for the heavy lifting. More on this below).

2. Arthur's point that a prefixed mem is really a different case
involving a primordial chirik rather than a sheva is mostly well taken
and I probably only muddied the waters by including it in my list -
however I don't think the case is entirely closed on the mem. I ask
Arthur to consider the case of "Meketsay" (Devarim 14/28, 28/49) - with
no appearance of the usual dagesh chazak in the second letter. Do you
still believe that a mem never produces a merachef? - of course many
people might claim that the sheva here is now a simple nach , which I
prefer not too since it is na in the root word. This is, however, a
preference (perhaps an idiosyncracy). I can't adduce much proof in such

3. Es Chataai Ani Mazkir Hayom - but in mitigation only a shogaig. In my
original posting I mentioned that a prepositional lamed will often
produce an unambiguous non-merachef situation by exhibiting a dagesh
chazak in the second letter. This is, of course, quite wrong. What I
should have said (and was thinking) is that it frequently produces an
unambiguous sheva nach by exhibiting a dagesh kal in the third letter.

4. In the unlikely event there are any readers left at this point (a lot
of the above might seem eye-glazingly boring stuff, perhaps because it
is) I do have an information request to post. I'm about to acquire a
modern PC for my home (we've been getting by on an IBM PC so old it has
a cassette port so that the primitive hunter-gatherer intended users
could store data on the seasonal migrations of mammoths on their tape
recorders) and would like to acquire some good Tanachic/Talmudic
software. I understand there are a number of CD ROM packages out but
don't know any details. I would like to be able to do searches of the
sort required to respond to Arthur (e.g. list all words n chumash with
initial letter bais with chirik and third letter beged-kefes). Can these
packages handle that? Which text of tanach do they use? Are variant
Massorahs included? A Biblia Hebraica? (just in case I ever feel the
urge to run some "code" algorithms/searches/statistics myself, I'd like
to see whether letter differences might affect things - of course a
cheaper solution is to roll over till the urge goes away). What about
Talmud and ease of doig topical or word searches? Does it include
Rashi/Tosephi?. responsa literature?, etc.  Are there any recent review
articles? If anyone has eperience/information/recommendation
with/about/for any available poackages I'd appreciate it if they would
get back to me or post it publicly.

Mechy Frankel			W: (703) 325-1277
<frankel@...>			H: (301) 593-3949


From: Ari Kurtz <s1553072@...>
Date: Fri, 8 Apr 1994 00:42:27 +0300
Subject: Fetal Reduction

Shalom Aliechem .
While I was reading David's Charlap's reply on Tom Divine's ethical 
questions in volume 12 no. 35. I remembered a passage in Sehedrin 
that relates that while a jew who has killed a fetus isn't considered
a murderer a non jew is considered a murderer for the same act (this
might actually be a single opinion in an argument) but if this is
the case then there might be different answers depending whose peforming
the operation whether they're jewish or not . Can anyone clarify on this ?

                                          Ari Kurtz

[David and I had some email back and forth on this topic, as my memory
is that when an abortion is permitted for a Jewish woman according to
Halacha, the doctor performing the abortion must be Jewish, for the
reason mentioned by Ari. If anyone can confirm and cite source, it would
be appreciated. Mod.]


From: <rmt51@...> (Rick Turkel)
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 94 00:42:16 EDT
Subject: Florence, Italy

There is a lovely old shul, the second tallest building in Florence
(after Il Duomo, the cathedral), at Via Luigi Carlo Farini 4.  Available
in the shul office is a list of commonly available foods (i.e., in any
supermarket) that are kosher as per the Italian rabbinate without any
visible hekhsher.  This includes any "pani non condito," bread baked
with no shortening whatsoever.  Next door to the shul, at Via L.C.
Farini 2 one flight up, is a kosher fleishig restaurant, called Il
Cuscussu` (at least that was its name in 1989, when I was last there).
Next door to that building, on the corner, is the Hotel Arizona, a
three-star hotel with small but adequate rooms.  This entire group of
buildings is about two km from the railroad station and near many of
the museums, etc.  Florence is a very walkable city, many of the
museums are free, and the restaurant serves on shabbat to those who
have purchased meals in advance, so it's a good place to be over a
shabbat.  Check one of the Jewish travel guides for more up-to-date

An aside: on the Friday morning I was there, I came down for breakfast
in the hotel.  I started "Jewish geography" with the frummie couple
who were already eating.  When I said I was from Columbus, Ohio, they
said they had met a couple from Columbus in the restaurant the previous
evening.  Since Columbus isn't a huge Jewish community and I figured I'd
probably know anyone who would go out of their way to find a kosher
restaurant, I asked if they remembered their name.  They said no, but
that they were newlyweds.  I replied that I knew exactly who they were;
the kalla's sister lives right down the street from me, and I car-pool
to work with her brother-in-law!  I knew they were getting married but I
had no idea they were going to Europe on their honeymoon.  Weird, huh?
The five of us ended up spending much of shabbat wandering the streets
together, since it was summer and the day was long.

Hag ha`atzma'ut sameach.

Rick Turkel         (___  ____  _  _  _  _  _     _  ___   _   _ _  ___
(<rmt51@...>)         )    |   |  \  )  |/ \     |    |   |   \_)    |
Rich or poor,          /     |  _| __)/   | __)    | ___|_  |  _( \    |
it's good to have money.            Ko rano rani,  |  u jamu pada.


From: <jsharf@...> (Joshua Sharf)
Date: Fri, 15 Apr 94 13:29:49 EDT
Subject: Kipot

Relative to the discussion about when to wear a Kipah, I think a little
history is in order.  While the so-called Black Hats and the Chassidim
have always worn hats, mainstream, mitnaggid Orthodox only began doing
so recently.  According to a local rabbi, wearing a kipah out and about
only became widespread among college students the '60s, and did so more
as a political statement after the Six Day War, rather than as a
religious act.  Perhaps someone with a longer memory than mine can
confirm or deny this.

[To the extent that YU is mainstream, mitnaggid Orthodox, I and all of
my friends wore kippot from early childhood. That only gets you back to
around 1959/1960, but as a 4/5 year old we were not making any political
statements. Mod.]

The issue of sanctifying every act can cut both ways.  It certainly can
serve to remind the wearer, but that's what a tallit katan is for.  More
often, wearing a kippah serves to show *others* that you consider
youself an observant Jew, and to make you, like it or not, a
representative.  Since Jews tend to get judged by the actions of the
few, this raises the stakes for your personal, day-to-day behavior

On the other hand, it does have its lighter moments.  This same rabbi
likes to talk about how his classmates would go out to sample some of
the high-quality Times Square entertainment.  It was always an
"interesting sociological study" as to where each person *took off* his
kipah.  Remember, these are rabbinical students we're talking about.


From: <simon1@...> (Simon /Simcha/ Streltsov)
Date: Wed, 20 Apr 1994 10:18:06 -0400
Subject: New Jewish List in Boston

There is a new mailing list BU-HILLEL with information about Jewish
events in Boston area :

to subscribe send a line
sub BU-HILLEL first_name last_name

If you know about any interesting events - please, feel free to
contribute - even if you are not a subscriber.  (send it to

And tell your friends about this list.

Simon /Simcha/ Streltsov
Boston University

p.s. to see the list of archived messages and other available commands
index bu-hillel
to <listserv@...>


From: <leo@...> (Leonard Oppenheimer +1 908 615 5071)
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 21:38:12 -0400
Subject: Primers on Judaism

> Can anyone recommend a general book on "Judaism"/Jewish Law for a
> highly intelligent, very well secularly educated person with very
> little formal or informal Jewish education (i.e. only Sunday
> Hebrew school kind of thing.)  Nothing "Art Scroll like", nothing
> right wing and nothing too touchy-feely please.  Thanks.

Two books come to mind:

1) "The Faith of Judaism", by Isidore Epstein.  A very well researched
and written book on the basics of Jewish belief and thought.

2) "This is my G-D", by Herman Wouk.  A fascinating description of the
famous author's road to observance, with a good amount of basic Jewish
thought and a nice dose of humor.

Lenny Oppenheimer

From: Aryeh Frimer <F66235@...>
Date: Sun, 24 Apr 1994 01:40:30 -0400
Subject: Primers on Judaism

Primers on Judaism: I recommend Rabbi Donnin's "To Be A Jew"


From: Nathan Katz <NKATZ@...>
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 1994 20:18:13 -0400
Subject: Taiwan

 This information is taken from ASIA-PACIFIC SURVIVAL GUIDE, a useful
publication of the Asia-Pacific Jewish Assn. of Melbourne, Asutralia,
tel (03) 602 1622: The Taiwan Jewish Community (TJC) has a center in
suburban Peitou. There are Friday evening services (no mechitzah). TJC
telephone 8718288. The president is Donald Shapiro, tel. 8934195. "There
are regular shabbat services at the President Hotel (tel. 5195251),
catering to the needs of observant Jewish business travellers who prefer
to worship in accordance with strict orthodox liturgy, with mechitzah,
and who will not travel the 15 kms. on Holy Days to the Jewish Centre...
The Ritz Hotel (tel. 5971234) also serves as a venue for regular shabbat
services..." There are any number of STRICTLY vegetarian "Buddhist"
restaurants (no dairy products are used), including Peace Vegetarian
Restaurant; Buddhist Vegetarian Restaurant (tel 5213169 or 5628568); and
Taipei Meilin Vegetarian Restaurant (tel. 3910723 or 3910833). Finally,
there is Y.Y.'s Kitchen and Steak House (49 Chung Shan N Road, Sec. 3;
tel. 5922868/9, near the President Hotel, which bills itself as the only
kosher restaurant in Taiwan. From the guide: "Mr. Y.Y. Hsu... has
long-establioshed associations with visiting religiously-observant
Jewish businessman and liaises with a local Jewish resident with
rabbinical training in dinei kashrut. A separate refrigerator, under
lock and key, provides storage for a wide variety of sealed American
kosher products, including frozen meats... Meals are prepared separately
on tinfoil. Separate glass crockery and utensiuls are used and are
washed in separate containers." BON VOYAGE! --Nathan Katz


End of Volume 12 Issue 83