Volume 35 Number 63
                 Produced: Wed Nov 14  6:12:48 US/Eastern 2001

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

The Body of God
         [Eli Lansey]
A good book on Kashrus needed
         [Shoshana Ziskind]
Grape Juice
         [Joseph Mosseri]
Is this public domain?
         [Toby Robison]
Low Protein Foods
         [Josh Backon]
Minhag for Kiddish
         [Alan Friedenberg]
Opinions of Rishonim
         [Gil Student]
Pesach and Spring
         [Neal B. Jannol]
Poultry Trial
         [Henry Cohen]
Rambams 13 principles of faith EXPLICITLY in Torah
         [Russell Jay Hendel]
Rivka at the well
Selihot on Yom Kippur
         [Menashe Elyashiv]
Seudot Hodaya
         [Batya Medad]
Shalom Alekhem
         [Saul Davis]
         [Janet Rosenbaum]
Slichot on Yom Kippur
         [Beth and David Cohen]


From: Eli Lansey <elansey@...>
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 19:33:42 +0200 (IST)
Subject: The Body of God

Everyone is quoting various sources, many of which can be interpreted in
various different ways.  However, no one has considered the following.
God created the universe.
The universe is a physical entity.
Anything contained in the universe is physical, everything outside of the
universe is not.
Since God had to have been around before the start of the universe to
start it (nonwithstanding the Shem Havayah), there is no way one can
believe that God created the universe if one believes G-d has a body
since a body is by definition only a concept that exists in the universe.


From: Shoshana Ziskind <shoshele@...>
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 12:06:27 -0500
Subject: A good book on Kashrus needed


My friend and I are studying together. She's a kallah and I'm recently
married so we figured we should study kashrus.  We started out with a
general book on Kashrus that Artscroll puts out but its not working out
using it.  There's a lot of terms with no practical explanation and its
not really a shiuch book for us.

What we'd like is something with more practical everyday examples as
well as more practical down to earth language.  What was really good
about learning kashrus at the woman's yeshiva we both went to in Israel
(Machon Alte which I highly reccomend) our teacher would always have
real life kashrus examples to make it clear.

Does such a sefer (or something like it) exist (and in print)?I've seen
one in Herew called baser vchalev (or something like that) which was
pictorial but its out of print both in Hebrew and in English. We would
probably be more comfortable learning in English by the way.

Thank you!
Kol tuv,
Shoshana Ziskind


From: Joseph Mosseri <JMosseri@...>
Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2001 23:58:40 -0500
Subject: Grape Juice

Can anybody help clarify this issue.
I've studied the halakhot of Yayin Nesekh and Setam Yenam in the Gemara,
Rambam, Tour, Bet Yosef, and numerous commentators  and I can not seem to
find any source for the current practice in the kashrut arena to forbid
any grape derived products. Be they juice, flavoring, coloring, etc..
What gives? What is this based upon?

 Thank you,
 Joseph Mosseri


From: Toby Robison <cpaths@...>
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 08:39:01 -0500
Subject: re: Is this public domain?

Robert <rkaiser1@...> > writes, regarding Joseph H. Hertz's magnum 
opus "Pentateuch & Haftorahs", that:

> is used in so many synagogues as the standard Chumash. The English 
> commentary was written back
> in 1936; doesn't that mean this text is now in the public domain? If not, 
> why, and when will it be public domain?
> My copy of this book says copyright 1960...

In general, an edition of any book published in the U.S. before 1923 is
likely to be in the public domain in the U.S. each EDITION of a book is
likely to deserve its own copyright. I blelieve the 1960 Hertz edition
was not just a copy of the 1936 version, for example; it included
additional haftorahs.

If you have a copy of the 1936 edition, it will fall into the public
domain much sooner than the 1960 edition.

There is a great deal of information about copyright on the web. Bear in
mind that many countries have different public domain rules. A good
place to start, to research these issues, is Project Gutenberg, which is
devoted to placing the e-texts of books in the public domain on the
web. PG takes copyright issues very seriously, and there are guidlines
at their web site, and also discussions of copyright in their bulletin
boards and in their regular postings to subscribers:

Project Gutenberg: http://www.promo.net/pg/

- toby robison


From: <BACKON@...> (Josh Backon)
Date: Tue,  13 Nov 2001 14:35 +0200
Subject: Re: Low Protein Foods

Dr. Ness asked whether for patients with aminoacidopathies, low protein
foods under hashgacha are available. If they are available, then fine.
But I don't see any halachic justification for providing very young
children with severe mental retardation with special kosher food. For
whom ? For patients with argininosuccinic aciduria ? Most poskim rule
that such children (or adults) are in the category of *shoteh* and can,
for example, be placed in non-Jewish institutions where non-kosher food
is served [see: Iggrot Moshe OC II:88].

Josh Backon


From: Alan Friedenberg <elshpen@...>
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 06:53:04 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Minhag for Kiddish

I have a friend who always places his left hand on the challah cover
while making kiddish.  He says he picked up this minhag while learning
in Torah Vodaas many years ago.  He doesn't remember the source.  I've
looked in several collections of minhagim, but have not found it
mentioned.  Does anyone know the source of this particular minhag?

-- Alan --


From: Gil Student <gil_student@...>
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2001 17:35:49 -0400
Subject: Re: Opinions of Rishonim

Eliezer Finkelman wrote:

>3) I grant the value of a relatively uniform standard in practical 
>halakhah: I have to know if I can eat the
>food you cooked; you have to know if you can eat in my
>sukkah.  If you decide to kasher liver according to Maimonides' recipe, 
>even though you depend on a great
>Rishon, you may have trouble getting anyone who keeps
>kosher now to eat with you.

How is the definition of a heretic not halachic?  I have to know if I
can eat from your shechitah, drink from wine you touched, etc.

Gil Student


From: <nbj@...> (Neal B. Jannol)
Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 9:59:56 -0800
Subject: Pesach and Spring

Pesach falls very early in the solar calendar this year, almost not
making it into spring - is this the closest we have been - when do we
next get this close?

Neal B. Jannol
Riordan & McKinzie


From: Henry Cohen <hcohen9@...>
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 18:35:33 -0500
Subject: Poultry Trial

I recently asked whether anyone knew about a trial of kosher butchers
which took place in new york in the 20's or 30's. I did get some
detailed replies , however none was the one my friend 's mother
participated in as a tranalator in the early 30's . I have since seen
the drawings with yiddish writing which were given to her. It involved
the schechter poultry company. Is anyone familiar with this trial?

 Thank you,
 Henry Cohen


From: <rhendel@...> (Russell Jay Hendel)
Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2001 21:52:18 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: RE: Rambams 13 principles of faith EXPLICITLY in Torah

Bernard Raab in v35n57 explicitly (grin) asks me:

>>In passing the so-called 13 principles of faith were not produced by
>>Maimonidees. They ALL explicitly occur in the Bible: Thus the 1st
>>decalogue mentions the existence of God and the prohibition of
>>Russell Jay Hendel;http://www.RashiYomi.Com/mj.htm
>What about the 13th; the belief in the coming of "ha-moshiach". Remember;
>you said "explicitly".
>Gmar tov--Bernie R.

This is a good question. What is mentioned explicitly is the
MESSIANIC ERA. So the king during that Messianic era would be
the Messiah. Here are the details.

(A) It explicitly mentions the possibility of >God widening
our borders which would necessitate 9 Refuge cities< (not 6)
(Cf Dt19-08 vs Nu35-13). (B) Furthermore it explicitly says that
we will eventually inherit 10 lands (not just 7) (Compare Gn15-19:21
vs the traditional promise of 7 nations eg Dt07-01). (C) Finally it
explicitly mentions that the exiles will be gathered and we will
have a new heart in doing commandments (eg Dt30-01:10)

Bottom line: The above says there will be an era when we will all
return to Israel with a renewed committment to observe Torah and we
will rule over 10 vs 7 lands.

It seems reasonable to call this era the Messianic era. The king
that reigned during that era is the Messiah.

Russell Jay Hendel; http://www.RashiYomi.Com/


From: A.M.Goldstein <mzieashr@...>
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2001 10:28:49 +0200
Subject: Rivka at the well

Presumably Rivka imenu came from a well-to-do household.  If that
supposition holds, then why was she the one sent to draw up water?  Why
was it not some servant?  Does anyone know of any Midrash or any other
source pertaining to this question?  The same question might apply to
Jethro (Yitro) and his daughters, who went to the well.

A. M. Goldstein
Editor, Focus
University of Haifa
Tel.: 972-4-8240104; Fax:  972-4-342104


From: Menashe Elyashiv <elyashm@...>
Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 20:09:12 +0200 (IST)
Subject: Selihot on Yom Kippur

Yom Kippur should be the most important day of Selihot - in the Sefaradi
minhag Selihot are said after each hazarat ha'shas (in Arvit - after the
silent Amida). Also in the Yeminite minhag, where the shaliah sibbur can
chose what Selihot to say.

The Aruch Ha'Shulhan quotes the Geonim that says that the 13 Middot are
said 26 times on Y"K, and then says that the minhag(!) ways change
because the hazzanim spend so much time on Piuttim that there is no time
left for Selihot.....


From: Batya Medad <ybmedad@...>
Subject: Seudot Hodaya

My husband's away so I'll try to answer; anyway, to be honest I have
more personal experience with them.  First of all the individual who was
saved or surived is responsible for his own seudat hodaya.  Joint ones
with others who shared the same danger are also acceptable and very
special for all.  The rabbis here in Shiloh generally instruct that one
does it as soon as possible.  There are occassions that a seudah is held
even if there's no need to bench hagomel.  For instance, I was in a car
that just missed being on the road when Dovid Boim was murdered at Beit
El a few years ago.  We weren't in danger at all, didn't even hear the
shooting.  But the driver was very shaken up, because her work kept her
travelling on the roads all the time, and for the first time she
realized that her life was in danger; she explained this to the rav or
Rosh yeshiva, and the psak was not to bench hagomel, but to have an
immediate seudat hodaya.  So that very night, all of us in the car, our
spouses and enough neighbors to make a minyan gathered for a seudat



From: <davis@...> (Saul Davis)
Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 22:18:36 +0200
Subject: Shalom Alekhem

Michael J. Savitz asked in mail-jewish Vol. 35 #61 about the plural form
used in "shalom alekhem", and in "Hamaqom yenakhem ethkhem ..." but not
necessarily in the Rosh Hashana greeting "tikatev ... " or "tikatavu
 ... ".

It is a Hebrew idiom to use the plural when referring directly and
formally to someone important. This is called the majestic plural
similar to the English royal "we", still used by HRH the Queen
today. Thus in Modern Hebrew we say "baalim" (=owners) even when there
is only one owner (compare Shemoth 21:29).  Likewise Hashem is always
referred to in the plural: Elokim (literally = G-ds) and Adoshem
(literally = masters) not "adonee". Shalom alekhem is formal greeting
and is used in the plural as a sign of respect. Note that the Arabic
equivalent is also in the plural ("salaam alequm"). I would like to know
the Jewish sources of shalom alekhem, it does not seem to be in the
Tanakh, it occurs a few times in the Talmud Yerushalmi, the Talmud Bavli
has a few occurences of shalom alekha (ie the singular form).

"Hamaqom yenakhem ethkhem ..." is usually said to the family as a
group. The concept is collective, comforting all Jewish mourners
together. (I thought that "Hamaqom yenakhem ethkhem ..." might be a
quote but I could not find a source.)

The Rosh Hashana blessing is less formal and is changed to conform with
the person being blessed.

Saul Davis


From: Janet Rosenbaum <jerosenb@...>
Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2001 14:55:10 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Shmira

In reference to the article in today's NYT about shmira for the Sept 11

Why can a woman not sit shmira for a man, but a man can for a woman, or
is the article wrong?



From: Beth and David Cohen <bdcohen@...>
Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2001 20:02:02 -0500
Subject: Slichot on Yom Kippur

When Rabbi K. Auman (now the rabbi of YI of Flatbush)was the rabbi at
the Young Israel of Stamford, CT, he instituted the saying of selichot
for all the tefilot of Yom Kippur as were found in the Adler Machzor
which was used by the congregation at that time.

David I. Cohen


End of Volume 35 Issue 63