Volume 36 Number 15
                 Produced: Wed Mar 27  5:33:55 US/Eastern 2002

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Baruch hu uvaruch sh'mo
         [David Ziants]
Friday Nite Davening (2)
         [Yisrael and Batya Medad, Rose Landowne]
         [Boruch Merzel]
         [David Ziants]
Kitniyot on (Ashkenazi) Pesach plates
         [Robert Israel]
Muksah question (3)
         [Michael Kahn, Josh Backon, Cohen, David A]
Parshat Zachor
Pet Food
         [Paul Merling]
Tzipi & Gad Shemesh HY"D
         [Paul Ginsburg]
         [Leona Kroll]


From: David Ziants <dziants@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 10:47:30 +0200
Subject: Baruch hu uvaruch sh'mo

I have another question similar to that of Yitz Weiss.

It is well known, to those that know halacha, that one doesn't respond
"baruch hu uvaruch sh'mo" during the b'rachot of sh'ma at arvit or
shacharit because of hefsek (interruption).

Yet, in the (Orthodox) United Synagogue community I was brought up in
England, many of the congregants did say this (in violation of the
halacha that we know).

We know that the people in this type of community were not always the
most knowledgeable - also many of the congregants came to shul out of
tradition but were not always shomrei shabbat.

Still, I am sure that the congregants who give the response did not
develop the "need" to do this in vacuum. They obviously learnt this from
some where, or saw it as their (mistaken) tradition. Does any one know
from where this came?

David Ziants

Ma'aleh Adumim, Israel 


From: Yisrael and Batya Medad <ybmedad@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 19:38:54 +0200
Subject: Friday Nite Davening

Re: the query of: <YitzW@...> (Yitz Weiss)
>Any idea where the minhag not to say "baruch hu uvaruch shmo" in the
>chazzan's mini-repetition of shemoneh esrai on Friday night comes from?
>I'm having trouble locating a source for it.

I'm fairly sure I once asked that question many years ago and also sure
that I never got an answer.  Most schules that I've been at do interrupt
the Chazan and pronounce the "baruch hu" bit but when I learned how to
daven at the old Holliswood Jewish Center (now the YI of...) when Rav
Pinchas Brenner (now Chief Ashkenazi Rabbi of Caracas) was there, he
specifically asked that there not be any interruption.  And so I do not
make the addition.

In "Ishei Yisrael" (which I've referred to in other replies, even though
he does take a more 'machmir' approach), he notes on page 363 that the
Gra deems that only the Chazan says the Mei'ain Sheva blessing and the
congregation is quiet and gives as references Ma'aseh HaRav Siman Katan
117 and the Arukh HaShulchan op.cit. [but i'm not sure to where he is
referring here; it's not clear to me] 17.

It seems that there is a dispute as to whether the Mei'ain Sheva is
considered as an actual Chazarat HaShatz (repetition of the Amidah
prayer) or not and that would also need perhaps a bowing or whether one
says it without a minyan, see Responsum Tzel HaChochmah Vol. IV, 111.
The Butzascher does consider it a repetition and therefore obligates a
'yehi ratzon' and the end but not 'hashem sfatai eftach' at the

From: <ROSELANDOW@...> (Rose Landowne)
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 04:10:50 EST
Subject: Re: Friday Nite Davening

I would assume that since it' s not a repetition of the amidah we've just 
said, it's tefillat hatzibor, and we want to be yotzai with the Bracha. 
Rose Landowne

<< Any idea where the minhag not to say "baruch hu uvaruch shmo" in the
chazzan's mini-repetition of shemoneh esrai on Friday night comes from?
I'm having trouble locating a source for it. >>


From: <BoJoM@...> (Boruch Merzel)
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 11:07:37 EST
Subject: Re: Kitniot

Rose Landowne writes in Vol 36 #13:
<< In Israel you can buy kosher l'pesach kitniot. Then you can eat it on
 the shabbat after pesach . I think, however, that there is a problem
 with using it on your pesach kelim if you do not eat kitniot on pesach>> 

Kitniyos is not chometz, therefore need not be sold before Pesach;
Kitniyos does not make vessels chometzdig.  For this reason an Ashkenazi
may eat in the homes of Safardim, as long as he/she does not eat any
thing that is actually kitnyios or that has been cooked together with
kitniyos.  Ashkenazim refrain from eating kitniyos only because of

Boruch Merzel


From: David Ziants <dziants@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 10:22:04 +0200
Subject: Re: Kitniyos

From: <ROSELANDOW@...> (Rose Landowne):
> In Israel you can buy kosher l'pesach kitniot. Then you can eat it on
> the shabbat after pesach . I think, however, that there is a problem
> with using it on your pesach kelim if you do not eat kitniot on
> pesach. 

My understanding is that there would be a problem on using kitniot which
are *not* kosher l'pesach on pesach keilim. The example I remember
seeing in the chutz la'aretz pesach guides (for all the days of the
chag) is baby foods which are not kosher l'pesach, and which might
contain kitniot. These can still be used on pesach for your baby, but
one must have separate kelim just in case of stray chametz mixed in.

Kitniot which is kasher l'pesach for s'phardim, has had to have been
well checked for stray grains, and the issur for ashkenazim is because
of custom rather than a real chametz problem. Why should there be an
issue of not using ones pesach kelim for this on the shabbat directly
after pesach?

David Ziants
Ma'aleh Adumim, Israel


From: Robert Israel <israel@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 01:16:23 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Kitniyot on (Ashkenazi) Pesach plates

> From: Perry Zamek <jerusalem@...>
> Wasn't there a case in 19th century Europe where, because of a shortage
> of wheat, kitniyot were permitted (as a Hora'at Sha'ah, which probably
> would have been more difficult to effect if kitniyot were hametz)?

See "The War of the Kitniyot (Legumes)" by Seymour Siegel, in
"Perspectives on Jews and Judaism", The Rabbinical Assembly, 1978 [if
you don't mind a Conservative source].  It occurred in Lithuania in
1868, due to a catastrophic rise in the price of wheat.  Some of the
rabbis permitted the use of beans, peas and millet, others refused.  It
became a source of controversy between the maskilim and the rabbis who

Robert Israel                                <israel@...>
Department of Mathematics        http://www.math.ubc.ca/~israel
University of British Columbia
Vancouver, BC, Canada V6T 1Z2


From: Michael Kahn <mi_kahn@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 07:09:50 -0500
Subject: Re: Muksah question

Frank Silbermann <fs@...> asks if attaching, say, a compass
or house key to a muktzah item free these objects from their muksah
status -- making each item a vessel with both permitted and
non-permitted uses?

 From the context of his question I think the next step in his question
is if then one may carry the muktzah item (in this case a kit needed for
pikuach nefesh) outside (hotzah) on Yom Tov.

This raises another famouse issue. Is it permitted to carry two things
that are attached together on Yom Tov when you only need to carry one of
them for example keys on a key chain one of the keys. I know the Shmiras
shabos Kehilchaso discusses a tshuva from Reb Moshe on this. If I
remember correctly Reb Moshe permits it but others forbid it, but I'm
not sure, and own neither sforim. The practical aplicatian of this
shailah is if in Mr.  Silbermann's case (still unresolved) it's better
to consider attaching a house key to the kit than a compass (unless you
live in a really confusing neiborhood) when it comes to the shailah of
hotzah or a compass is also acceptable.

Yitzchak Kahn

From: <BACKON@...> (Josh Backon)
Date: Mon,  25 Mar 2002 10:32 +0200
Subject: Re: Muksah question

Someone who without carrying an adrenaline injector to prevent (fatal)
anaphylactic shock as a result of a bee sting would fall into the
category of "choleh she'ein bo sakanah" since one of the definitions of
"choleh she'ein bo sakanah" is that of a healthy person who *could* be
seriously ill if he didn't receive a medication in time (as per Iggrot
Moshe OC III 91 and Nishmat Avraham I (OC) 328 Oht 3).

As such, the prohibition of "shevut she'yesh bo ma'aseh" (e.g. moving
something which is muktzeh) is overridden provided there is a "shinui"
(change) in the way it is carried out (see: Orach Chaim 328:17 3rd
opinion [which is that of the Ramban in Torat haAdam Shaar haMichush).

As for carrying the adrenaline injector in a place which is not Reshut
HaRabbim d'Oraita and which does NOT have an Eruv: if the drug is
essential for the patient to have with him all the time and the purpose
of leaving his house is for a Mitzva (e.g. going to shul) and the
carrying is done with a *shinui*, there are those who permit (see:
Nishmat Avraham OC 301 oht 2 in the name of Mishneh halachot VII 56;
Shmirat Shabbat K'Hilchata 40:7; Maharash Engel III 43) and there are
those who forbid carrying (Tzitz Eliezer XIII 34).

Dr. Josh Backon
Hebrew University
Faculty of Medicine

From: Cohen, David A <davidaco@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 18:39:43 -0500
Subject: RE: Muksah question

> Violating a Shabbas prohibition is very serious, and only a qualified
>rabbi can decide whether the danger is serious enough to warrant a heter
>to carry life-saving tools.  Because he's not _likely_ to be stung on
>any given day, on Shabbas it seems to me that Shmerly probably should
>refrain from carrying and trust in Hashem's protection, or, if he feels
>the danger is too great -- stay home.
> But on Yom Tov it is understood that one can carry things if one does
>so for the sake of enjoying the festival, and the security provided by
>his kit when walking to visit neighbors would help Shmeryl's enjoyment
>of the Yom Tov immensely.  Is Shmeryl forbidden to carry them (without a
>special private heter) on the grounds that these items are muksah?

The question asked here is actually regarding something labeled as
"safek nefashot lehakel" - when there is uncertainty whether an act will
save a life or not, we are lenient. For example, if a building falls on
top of people, is it Mutar to dig through the rubble in the hope of
saving a life even though it is uncertain whether any life will be
saved? And the answer is of course, yes. Thus if the person were to
leave his house, he would probably be allowed to take his medicine with
him. The real question would then be, is he allowed to leave the house,
which a competent Halachik authority would have to answer on a
case-by-case basis.

Not by way of comparison, but in a similar vein, Hatzalah members are
allowed to carry their two-way radios with them on Shabbat to shul. This
is obviously an object that is not only muktzeh mehamat gufo, by its
nature, like the life-saving medicine is, but it is a more stringent
issur of muktzeh, which is mehamat issur. He is also allowed to carry
this muktzeh mereshut lereshut on Shabbat, i.e. an issur deorayta. The
reason for this is that if we tell the hatzalah people that they should
stay home on Shabbat if they want to volunteer, then they wouldn't
volunteer, and lives would be lost because of the lack of people
volunteering. Back in our case, the allergic man doesn't really have a
choice in the matter - he is allergic no matter what, and in this
instance it is possible that the rabbi would tell him that he must stay
home if he is afraid of getting stung and would not leave without
carrying it.

In terms of the muktzeh issue, I do not think (although I may be wrong)
that life-saving medicine is muktzeh. It is not useless, i.e. muktzeh
mechamat gufo, because it is useful in saving lives, and it is not
muktzeh mechamat issur because saving lives is not an issur, so in terms
of muktzeh, I would not think there is a problem with life-saving
medicine when there is a possibility that you might use it (if it is
impossible to use, like if its freezing outside, then it would be
muktzeh mechamat gufo because it is not useful for anything, but it
would still certainly not be muktzeh mechamat issur).

David A. Cohen



From: RP <chips@...>
Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2002 10:12:23 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Re: Parshat Zachor

}the end "lo tishcach" why the extra reminder? he says it means zachor ad
}shelo tiscach ie one should remember and should not forget , and we have
}seen a year is the time when one forgets. The chasam sofer was very
}particular about this and in a leap year he would have it read
}twice. Look in the sefer to see what he write its clearer than how i
}have explained it.
}Alex Pine.

I don't understand this, the regular reading of the Sedrah always comes
within 12 months of Parshas Zachor.



From: Paul Merling <MerlingP@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 09:55:52 -0500
Subject: Pet Food

 In a yearly very well accepted Hilchos Pesach digest, dry pet food is
said to be Chametz. Last years digest did allow certain kinds of dry cat
food. What does one do with a very finicky cat, who shows no interest in
any food outside of dry cat food.? The above digest does allow certain
canned food, but this is the very last option for as I mentioned the cat
is very particular and I fear that the cat may not eat for all 8
days. By the way the ingredients of the pet food show no wheat used, and
an e-mail to the company confirmed that no wheat is used. I did not
inquire about barley or oats, but I will do that immediately. Even if
they affirm that there are only the ingredients on the box, should one
believe them? A friend of mine thought that they could be sued if there
is an allergy and therefore they should be trusted. Also if one says
that ingredients such as chicken byproducts may contain some wheat, but
can one not rely on Bitul before Pesach? One solution I heard is to sell
the cat and all the needed cat food to a gentile neighbor. I would then
place in a receptacle the cat food for the eight days in an area rented
to the gentile. This is similar to a heter I have seen recently to sell
an aquarium and it's fish and to place the food for 8 days there. In the
above article they suggested placing some sort of Mechitza before the
aquarium, not possible in my situation. I will of course consult a
Poseik, yet I thought that maybe someone had a similar problem and could
they possibly post their solution as soon as possible. Chag Kasher


From: Paul Ginsburg <GinsburgP@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 12:32:33 -0500
Subject: Tzipi & Gad Shemesh HY"D

Would anyone happen to know the Hebrew names
for Tzipi & Gad  Shemesh HY"D who were killed March 21st
in the suicide bombing in Jerusalem?

Tzippora bas ?

Gad ben?

Thank you in advance for your help.

Paul W. Ginsburg


From: Leona Kroll <leona_kroll@...>
Date: Mon, 25 Mar 2002 02:45:11 -0800 (PST)
Subject: Wine


When does wine become problematic? I would say that by Chassidim (and
possibly others)- post-crushing, since Chassidim are careful not only
about wine but also about other grape products (ie- some will not drink
stout beer because it has grape skin extract in it, and since it is
extracted after the grapes are crushed for wine, its problematic).


End of Volume 36 Issue 15