Volume 37 Number 32
                 Produced: Wed Oct  9  5:16:45 US/Eastern 2002

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

19th century political ideas reflected in Torah commentaries
         [Zev Sero]
Bat Kohen (3)
         [Zev Sero, Mimi Markofsky, Toby Katz]
Cabbage on Hoshana Rabbbah
         [Fay Berger]
Canvas Sukkahs
         [Yisrael Medad]
Davening Toward a bathroom
         [Pudell, Steven J.]
Doing the Amidah repetition
Halachik Date Line
         [Dani Wassner]
Men vs. Women Carrying in Eiruv Chatzerot (2)
         [David Waxman, Avi Feldblum]
The proper place of mxica in Jewish theology
         [Janet Rosenbaum]
Question About the End of Yom Kippur
         [David Waxman]
Rambam on Eternity of the Torah
         [Shalom Carmy]
Selah Lanu
         [Menashe Elyashiv]
S'lach Lanu after Ne'ilah
         [Michael Rogovin]
Travel on (or close to) Shabbat & Yom Tov
         [Yehonatan Chipman]


From: Zev Sero <zev.sero@...>
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 19:36:09 -0400 
Subject: Re: 19th century political ideas reflected in Torah commentaries

See Malbim on Megillat Esther.

Zev Sero


From: Zev Sero <zev.sero@...>
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 19:40:48 -0400 
Subject: Re: Bat Kohen

> Are there any restrictions on a bat kohen entering a Jewish cemetery?

None at all.  The command is to `the sons of Aharon', and not to the
daughters of Aharon.  (Kiddushin 35a, Rambam Hil. Evel 3:11)

Zev Sero

From: <AUNTIEFIFI@...> (Mimi Markofsky)
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 23:49:00 EDT
Subject: Re: Bat Kohen

As a Bat Kohen (or Bat Kohen Gadol, as my mother would say!), none that
I know of.  As a matter of fact, I'm my father's sheliach during chodesh
Elul and go to the graves of his parents and sisters.

Mimi Markofsky

From: <T613K@...> (Toby Katz)
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 23:36:22 EDT
Subject: Re: Bat Kohen

Not a question you asked, but one I will answer anyway.  As an eshes
kohen, I asked whether there was any problem with my doing taharos.  The
answer was no, there are no restrictions, and no impact on my husband

Toby Katz


From: <JuniperViv@...> (Fay Berger)
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 22:28:50 EDT
Subject: Re: Cabbage on Hoshana Rabbbah

I learned this from my daughter,Shulamith Z. Berger.On Hoshana Rabbah we
say "Kol Mevaser." (Kol)Cole is cabbage.

Fay Berger


From: Yisrael Medad <ybmedad@...>
Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 20:11:16 +0200
Subject: Canvas Sukkahs

For over two decades I know that the main problem is assuring that the
walls are stable/strong = yatziv and that here in Israel you need to
have a bar or other floor-parallel element such as a strong rope that
will keep the walls from flapping.

I recall Rav Ovadia Yosef being involved.

Y. Medad


From: Pudell, Steven J. <Spudell@...>
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 14:55:07 -0400 
Subject: Davening Toward a bathroom

The east wall of our mincha minyan room has two doors.  One of them is a
bathroom.  The bathroom works, but no one uses it generally at any point
during the day.

Without going into other topics and tangents (e.g. whether you can daven
facing another direction etc.)--my question is simple-- is there a
problem of davening TOWARD a bathroom, which is behind a wall with a
closed door.  (There is no problem of "smell" in this case).  Id be
interested in any citation to sources that conclude either way that have
specifically dealt with this problem.  Ill do i my own research and let
you know what i find.

If you need more information -- you can ask at <spudell@...>




From: .cp. <chips@...>
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 08:18:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Doing the Amidah repetition

Mail Jewish readers,
I have been disconcerted by trend recently at the place i daven during
the week by different people.

People, the 4th, 5th and 6th words of the Amidah are `Eloheinu vElohei
Avoseinu`. They are 3 *separate* words, not 2 and for sure not 1 and
there are at least 9 syllables [i come up with 12].

If you are doing the duties of a `shliach tzybur` please keep in mind
what those words mean and the duties entailed therein.



From: Dani Wassner <dani@...>
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 10:50:15 +0200 
Subject: Halachik Date Line

This is a very complex issue, with far reaching and often bizarre
implications for those travelling anywhere between the West Coast of the
USA and Asia.

Essentially there are two main opinions observed today.

The first is that of the Chazon Ish who puts the halachik dateline at 90
degrees east of Jerusalem. However, he makes the important distinction
that the dateline follows the coastline of any continent. Following this
opinion means that any mainland communities (eg China, Australia) are ok
and can observe Shabbat on the day known locally as Saturday.

However, following the Chazon Ish's opinion, any islands- presumably
including New Zealand, Tasmania, Japan (perhaps even Hong Kong)- would
be problematic. In those places, Shabbat would have to be observed on

The other major opinion is that of Rav Tukeshinsky. According to him,
the halachik dateline runs 180 degrees from Jerusalem. Following Rav
Tukeshinsky, all of the above mentioned communities are now ok, but this
now places Hawaii (and other islands) on the wrong side. If this opinion
was followed, Hawaiian Jews would have to celebrate Shabbat on Friday.

According to most opinions, the "International Date Line", decided upon
by a group of mainly British men in the 1880s at a meeting in Greenwich
has no real halachic significance.

My understanding is that the Chief Rabbi of the British Empire (as it
was then), held by Rav Tukeshinsky. As a result, areas under his
jurisdiction such as New Zealand could have Shabbat on Saturday. The
Hawaiian community has clearly not held by Rav Tukeshinsky and therefore
also have Shabbat on Saturday.

None of this has to be particulalry problematic since we are talking
about a machloket (disagreement) acharonim. Therefore, one can follow
the minhag hamakom (local practice), and follow the Chazon Ish in Hawaii
and Rav Tukeshinsky in New Zealand (as their respective communities seem
to do).

The real problem arises when one visits a place with no Jewish
community, or when one is flying over such a place. (Example, many
Australian Jews will not fly to the US on a Sunday. If they do, they
could fly straight back into Shabbat the moment they take off from
Sydney on Sunday afternoon).

Dani Wassner, Jerusalem


From: David Waxman <yitz99@...>
Date: Sun, 06 Oct 2002 16:12:34 +0200
Subject: Re: Men vs. Women Carrying in Eiruv Chatzerot

>There is a well known story told about Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach, z'l.
>On shabbos, he noticed that one of the young men in his yeshiva who had
>just gotten married was standing by, watching his father set up chairs
>and tables for a sheva brachos meal.  Rabbi Auerbach said, "Why don't
>you help your father with the chairs and the tables?"  The young man
>replied, "My father is more meikel (lenien) than I am in this halacha
>(apparently someting about setting up folding tables and chairs, or
>moving things in an eiruv chatzerot, or the like).  Rabbi Auerbach was
>horrified at this and spoke about it publicly in the yeshiva as being
>"perverted logic."  Should this not apply to husbands and wives?


Maybe, but not exactly.  Certainly, the husband should obtain the
permission of his wife before adding to her burdens.  It doesn't sound
reasonable to me, however, to say that the husband can never take on a
chumra that would burden his wife.  Men wouldn't get much davening or
learning done under such circumstances!  (This brings to mind the
aggadic story of the Tana that was asked to become the Rosh Yeshiva and
responded that he had to ask his wife first.  He asked, got permission,
then accepted.)

From: Avi Feldblum <mljewish@...>
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 03:51:21 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Men vs. Women Carrying in Eiruv Chatzerot

On Sun, 6 Oct 2002, David Waxman wrote:
> This brings to mind the aggadic
> story of the Tana that was asked to become the Rosh Yeshiva and responded
> that he had to ask his wife first.  He asked, got permission, then accepted.)

The logical conclusion of which would be that before a man accepts upon
himself any additional chumra's that would affect his wife, he should
ensure that she is fully OK with him doing that.

Avi Feldblum


From: Janet Rosenbaum <jerosenb@...>
Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 17:53:51 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re:  The proper place of mxica in Jewish theology

Yehonatan and Randy Chipman <yonarand@...> writes:
>       Unfortunately, he fails to quote a single Rabbinic source to prove
> his claim. Rav Moshe Feinstein's famous teshuvah, found in Iggerot
> Moshe, Orah Hayyim, Vol. 1, sect. 39, and reprinted in the book on
> mehitzah, "The Sanctity of the Synagogue," is based on the premise that
> mehizah -- i.e, the principle of separation of the sexes in holy
> convocations -- is in fact de-oraita.  

Fwiw, in that same book, R Soloveitchik has two letters/essays.  The
first is a reflective essay about the nature of prayer and mechitza's
role; the second is a short note saying that he wants to be clear that
mechitza is not d'oraita, but d'rabbanan, although separation is

Mechitza isn't in the Shulchan Aruch.  
Does anyone know whether any rishonim discuss it, or whether there
really is a >1000 gap between its mention in the gemara in Sukkos (and
the gemara about the reeds in the pots) and the 19th century?



From: David Waxman <yitz99@...>
Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 17:15:16 +0200
Subject: Question About the End of Yom Kippur

> >>In regard to the question as to why we say "slach lanu" in the Maariv
>amidah right after Neilah:<<

One simple answer is that we continue to do t'shuva for aveirot our
entire lives.  Take David ha'melech as the prototype ba'al tshuvah.  He
never stopped.


From: Shalom Carmy <carmy@...>
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 10:21:56 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Rambam on Eternity of the Torah

> > There are many Toraitic commandments that halachic literature tells us
> > will never again be applicable. Most famously, the Rambam (although his
> > opinion is far from unanimously accepted) holds that animal sacrafices
> > will not be instituted in the 3rd Beit Hamikdash.

Repeating an untrue statement or attribution many many times may make it
famous, but does not make it true.


From: Menashe Elyashiv <elyashm@...>
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 14:21:14 +0200 (IST)
Subject: Selah Lanu

The record for the fastest post Yom Kippur Arvit - someone boasted that
he did it in 4 minutes... OTOH, in our Beit Kneset, we have no reason to
rush, because most of us keep Rabanu Tam time. We pray at our usual
pace, so maybe for that we say selah lanu...


From: <rogovin@...> (Michael Rogovin)
Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 9:21:16 -0500
Subject: Re: S'lach Lanu after Ne'ilah

I was once told in response to this question that the mechila sought
during Yom Kippur (and the previous 9 days) was for sins committed in
the previous year, that is prior to Rosh HaShana. Thus, the sins we ask
forgiveness for at Ma'ariv would be for those committed on or after Rosh
HaShana (including, presumably, any on Yom Kippur itself).

Michael Rogovin


From: Yehonatan Chipman <yonarand@...>
Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 17:13:02 +0200
Subject: Re: Travel on (or close to) Shabbat & Yom Tov

<CARLSINGER@...> (Carl Singer) wrote in MJ v37n28:
<< I wouldn't dare pasken nor suggest that someone spend Yom Tov in Penn
Station -- but I again recall a lesson learned from Rabbi Shmuel
Kaminestky - he was telling of visiting an old Jew in NYC on a Friday
morning, and this Jew chided him that he shouldn't travel on Fridays --
Beyond "engineering solutions" (and one can't be too smart, with
accidents, bad weather, etc.) -- I don't like rushing into Shabbos and
try to allow 2X time if forced to meet or be away from my (home) office
on Friday.>>

Rav Soloveitchik once commented on this at a shiur:  "The modern
Orthodox Jew knows how to keep Shabbas, but he doesn't know about  erev
Shabbas.  He rushes into Shabbas at 80 miles an hour...."
     The idea of having adequate time to prepare oneself for Shabbat --
not only to shower and change ones clothes for shul, but also
spiritually, to get into the Shabbat mode, and mood -- is very
important.  (Of course, I'm in no position to give mussar to others,
since I am fortunate enough to work at home.)
    I once wrote a piece about the rather unusual custom in my local
shul, of not saying Tahanun on Friday morning, in the same light.
Namely, that all day Friday is considered Erev Shabbat, and has a
special character!
   Yehonatan Chipman, Yerushalayim


End of Volume 37 Issue 32