Volume 42 Number 51
                 Produced: Sun Apr 25 12:55:31 US/Eastern 2004

Subjects Discussed In This Issue: 

Bnei Eretz Yisrael keeping one day of yom tov in chu"l
         [David Ziants]
An halakhic riddle
         [Elazar M Teitz]
One or Two Days of Yom Tov
         [Bernard Raab]
Palm Question
         [Gershon Dubin]
Prohibition of Benefiting from Chometz (2)
         [Janice Gelb, Yehuda Landy]
Question on Chametz Just After Pesach
         [Michael Mirsky]
Raising of Hands (formerly Duchaning Outside of Eretz Israel)
         [Yisrael Medad]
Rambam's Attitude to the Deceased
         [Yisrael Medad]
Was Aharon Ever Happy (4)
         [Michael Kahn, Joel Rich, Sholom Carmy, Esther Posen]


From: David Ziants <dziants@...>
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 21:26:50 +0300
Subject: Re: Bnei Eretz Yisrael keeping one day of yom tov in chu"l

From: Carl Singer <casinger@...>
> Someone posed this in shule.  
> An Israeli in Israel finishes Pesach, makes Havdolah, has chometz ....
> then boards a plane for, say, the U.S. and arrives on our "8th day"  ----

 From my understanding, the person or family should stay in the airport
until the "8th day" is finished. He can continue eating chametz, and
doing melacha as the problem of not separating himself from a community
(i.e. not doing melacha in public, etc.) only exists if one reaches a
Jewish community. I assume that there is no Jewish community in the
vicinity of the airport.

Another possibility might be getting in a taxi, train etc, but making
one's business to get off before enters a place where there is a Jewish
community and walk the rest. There is no problem of carrying on Yom Tov
(if there is a need to do so), even if the place doesn't have an eruv,
and his suitcases bags contain both muktza and non-muktza,thus not a
"basis" (=base surface) for muktza. I have no idea how practical this is
if one has to wak with a lot of luggage.

When one is within a Jewish community, the issue of "keeping" the extra
day publicly is just for show, rather than real, which is why one isn't
allowed to make any extra berachot etc.  (Receiving an aliya to the
Torah, if granted, is OK because in theory one can read portions from
the Torah in public at anytime, and say the berachot.)

A couple of intuitive answers, from my limited learning...

David Ziants
Ma'aleh Adumim, Israel


From: Elazar M Teitz <remt@...>
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 22:39:24 -0400
Subject: Re: An halakhic riddle

< ... Now suppose he makes this error during the evening prayer of Yom
Tov, which falls right after Shabbat.  Where does he recite the havdalah
prayer--in the middle of the (mistaken) atah honen prayer, with the
weekday ata honantanu havadalah formula, or in middle of the atah
behartanu prayer, with the Yom Tov havdalah formula 'vatodi`enu', etc.?
Or perhaps the middle of atah honen with the 'vatodienu' formula? I
don't think you will find this one in the Mishnah Berurah, but who
knows? >

        Logic dictates that he should say no havdalah in Atah Chonen.
The takanah of Atah Chonantanu was that it be said in Chonein Hada'as on
a _weekday_ following a day in which work was prohibited.  Yom Tov not
being such a day, there was no such takanah, and thus Atah Chonantanu is
not part of the text of the b'rachah on such a night.  Vatodi'einu, of
course, was never made part of that b'rachah. Hence, he should complete
the standard Atah Chonein, and then begin Atah V'chartanu with
Vatodi'einu, which _is_ a part of that b'rachah on Motza'ei Shabbos.



From: Bernard Raab <beraab@...>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 13:54:55 -0400
Subject: One or Two Days of Yom Tov

David Charlap wrote:
>Today, even though we have accurate calendars and instant communication,
>we still follow this as a custom, in order to comemorate what was
>necessary back then.
>So why don't we, in our comemoration of that practice, practice it today
>the way they must have had to practice it back then?

And  Simon Wanderer added:

>This is in fact the position of at least one important P'sak on the
>issue (if I remember correctly, that of R' Shmuel Salant). It clearly
>has some sense to it, but is, nevertheless, a minority opinion. Perhaps
>the explanation is that since nowadays the reason for observing two days
>is not a practical one but based on maintaining a vestige of the former
>practice, the Takana was applied to *communities* (as this would have
>the effect of retaining the basic form of the historic practice) and did
>not incorporate every intricacy.

There was in fact another important posek who ruled that the travellers
to E"Y should only observe one day of YT: The Chacham Tzvi who headed
the Hamburg Jewish community in the 18th (19th?) century. He too was
judged to be in the minority, but today we find more and more modern
poskim on the side of the Salanter and the Chacham Tzvi. My own Rav,
Rabbi Neil Winkler of Young Israel of Fort Lee, points out that this was
never regarded as a local custom or minhag, which generally "travels
with" the traveller, but was always regarded as a halacha based on
location, and so should NOT "travel with". More and more rabbis are
coming to this realization and are ruling that travellers to E"Y should
observe one day of YT, and correspondingly, B'nei Eretz Yisrael in chu'l
should fully observe two days.

b'shalom--Bernie R.


From: <gershon.dubin@...> (Gershon Dubin)
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 14:01:15 -0400
Subject: Palm Question

Does anyone know how to download, to a Palm, the Mincha map from the
Agudah that's on the OU website?  I have a version several years old
that I d/l but forgot how I did it then, and both the Agudah and OU tell
me it's been updated since then.

I asked the webmaster at Pilotyid.com, and he didn't know.  Anyone?



From: Janice Gelb <j_gelb@...>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 17:44:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Re: Prohibition of Benefiting from Chometz

<Smwise3@...> wrote:
> On the 8th Day of Pesach (and the 2d Day, when this isn't a problem), I
> need to walk a half hour to a Yom Tov Sheni minyan.  Along the way I
> pass two major commercial bakeries.  While of course it is no problem on
> the 2d Day of Yom Tov, but on the last day, when for Bnai Eretz Yisroel
> chometz is permitted, the bakeries are working full time and the aroma
> of chometz wafts through the air.
> Of course, I can't stop breathing, but I do wonder whether the aroma of
> freshly baked chometz is considered a prohibition of benefiting from
> chometz on Pesach.  And if it is, is the prohibition less because the
> 8th Day is mi-derabanan?

Considering this probably causes you more frustration than benefit, my
vote would be that it doesn't count as hana'ah :->

-- Janice

From: <nzion@...> (Yehuda Landy)
Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 04:44:50 +0200
Subject: Re: Prohibition of Benefiting from Chometz

According to the Rambam it depends on whether you have intention to
benefit. If you do not have intention to benefit it is surely no
problem.  [This is w/o checking the halachic status of smelling, which I
seem to recall is generally forbiiden in the case of Isurei Ha'na'ah]

					Yehuda Landy


From: <mirskym@...> (Michael Mirsky)
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:51:21 -0400
Subject: Question on Chametz Just After Pesach

A question came up in regard to my son who was visiting here in Toronto
for Pesach.  He was keeping only 7 days here.  At Maariv time for our
8th day, it was no longer Pesach for him, but he realized that during
the afternoon of the 7th day, Pesach was already over in Israel, and the
chametz he sold in Israel might have come back into his possession in
his apartment in Israel even though for him personally there were still
7 hours of Pesach remaining (in Toronto).

This issue would apply in any circumstance where different time zones
are involved, eg.  sell chametz in East coast and spend Pesach on West

The pasuk says "lo yira'eh L'CHA chametz".  Does that mean where you are
currently living and ALSO in properties you own elsewhere?

I have never heard of a problem about this, but how is the issue
avoided?  No kinyan is necessary for him to reaquire the chametz, so who
owns it at that time?  Does the contract with the non-Jew stipulate that
the return of chametz happens whenever Pesach ends for the Jewish owner,
whereever he may be?  If so, shouldn't that be something provided at the
time of the sale so it can be included in the contract?

Any comments?

Michael Mirsky


From: Yisrael Medad <ybmedad@...>
Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2004 00:04:00 +0200
Subject: Raising of Hands (formerly Duchaning Outside of Eretz Israel)

Several persons, in reply to my mentioning a source I found in R' Isaac
the Blind regarding the raising of hands as a custom being halted after
the Temple's destruction and to avoid copying early Christian customs,
as interpreted by Chaviva Peaya in her new book, suggested that this
raising of the hands was not by Kohanim during duchaning but a general
custom of all worshippers.

I should have kept reading.  For your general knowledge:

She insists that from another source, the Sefer Bahir, Simanim 135-139,
as well as the Ramban on Exodus 17:12, that this incident is the source
for the raising of the hands of the Kohanim, even if the Ramban is
influenced by the Sefer Bahir not only due to the act of raising the
hands, but the saying of the Tetragrammaton.  However, she also brings
the Midrash of Pirkei DeRav Eliezer, 44, 104B-105A, that describes all
the congregation of Israel imitating Moshe's actions of bowing at the
knees, prostrating, extending out the hands towards heaven.  She notes
that in the Otzar Geonim Sotah 38B, p. 255, the act of extending hands
is identified with the Priestly Blessing.

Nevertheless, she summarizes by insisting that Moshe's act is one akin to

Yisrael Medad


From: Yisrael Medad <ybmedad@...>
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 2004 22:18:22 +0200
Subject: Rambam's Attitude to the Deceased

The Rambam writes in Sefer Avodah, Hilchot Psulei HaM'Kudashin,
Chapt. 15, Halacha 9 that if someone sacrificed on behalf of a dead
person (lit.: "l'shem met"), although the sacrifice intrinsically is
still valid, it does not count for the owners because "ein kapara
lametim", i.e., there is no expiation for the dead.

The question that arose in my study group is: does the Rambam regard
this principle as one to be interpreted solely within the strict sphere
of the validity and merits derived from a sacrifice, or, can one presume
that various practices and customs that people observe "l'ilui" the
souls of dead persons would be frowned upon and rejected by the Rambam.

Anyone know of articles or sources on this topic?

Yisrael Medad


From: Michael Kahn <mi_kahn@...>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 07:16:34 -0400
Subject: RE: Was Aharon Ever Happy

Ahron was not a person that we should psychoanalyze. This is because he
was on a spiritual plane way above what we can relate too. This is what
I have been taught.

In addition to having been taught this, I also found a medrash quoted as
follows. The pasuk says, Uvinviay Al Taraiu, literally translated, amd
to my prophets (Uvinviay) do not (Al ) harm (Taraiu). The medrash
darshins the words taraiu to mean become friendly with, relating the
word taraiu to the word reah for friend and explains the pasuk as
saying, do not become to "friendly" with My prophets, by thinking you
can understand them as you would a friend. (I have to look at the
medrash again to get the exact terminology right.)

Ahron does not belong on the coach.

From: <Joelirich@...> (Joel Rich)
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 08:44:26 EDT
Subject: Was Aharon Ever Happy

Perhaps we can learn from Moshe who could be viewed as having a life
full of disappointments yet we say every shabbat "yismach moshe bmatnat
chelko" - he was happy with his lot , why?  "ki eved neeman karata lo"
because HKB"H called him a faithful servant.  A true eved hashem (
halavai I were at that level) is "happy" as per R' YD Soloveitchik ,
when he realizes that Hkb"h is in control of the world . We do our
hishtadlut(effort) as required by HKB"H and whatever happens is HKB"H's
calculation not ours. We are judged on our efforts not the results.

Kol Tuv,
Joel Rich

From: <carmy@...> (Sholom Carmy)
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 13:31:37 -0400
Subject: Was Aharon Ever Happy

The Humash says "He will see you and rejoice." Is it necessary to regard
Aharon as the psychological equivalent of an envious academic whose life
is dominated by resentment of those more prominent than he?


From: Esther Posen <eposen@...>
Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 09:17:38 -0500
Subject: RE: Was Aharon Ever Happy

There is a yiddish expression that translates "Don't put on your small
kaputah (jacket)on Avrohom Avinu."  Next someone will ask if Ahron saw a
therapist or took Prozac.  I recall a Medrash about Ahron - when Moshe
was chosen to lead the Jewish people Ahron "samach b'libo" (was happy in
his heart) and had he known the Torah would discuss this he would have
greeted Moshe b'tupim u'mcholos (fife & drums?)

Ahron's life was 100% dedicated to the service of Hashem and I have no
doubt that he had a clear understanding of his purpose in life and faith
that whatever Hashem does is for the best.  It is demeaning to inflict
our 21st century definition of happiness, good job, nice house, shul
president on Ahron Ha'kohen.

Esther Posen


End of Volume 42 Issue 51