Volume 47 Number 68
Produced: Tue Apr 19 6:09:37 EDT 2005
Subjects Discussed In This Issue:
Addition to Haggada - in Israel only
[David Mescheloff]
Developing Halacha (2)
[David I. Cohen, David I. Cohen]
Quinoa for Pesach (6)
[David Eisen, Aliza Berger, Warren Burstein, Avi Frydman,
Michael Mirsky, Martin Stern]
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From: David Mescheloff <david_mescheloff@...>
Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2005 00:01:10 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: Addition to Haggada - in Israel only
The story of the exodus from Egypt is told in the haggada, after the
questions about this night being different from all others, and after
the first answers ( "We were slaves ... and G-d took us out ..." and
"Our ancestors were idol worshippers ... and now G-d brought us near"),
by our reading 4 verses from the speech of thanks to G-d, which the
Torah says should be recited by the person who brings his first fruits
to the Temple in Jerusalem (earlier: to the tabernacle in Shilo),
between Shavuot and Succot. These four verses, from Devarim, tell the
story of our descent into slavery in Egypt, our becoming a great nation,
our suffering, our crying out to G-d, and G-d's redeeming us from there.
These verses are the basis for the gratitude of the one who brings his
first fruits, who recalls our humble beginnings and thanks G-d for the
wonderful gifts G-d has given him.
These same verses were chosen by our sages as a concise vehicle for
fulfilling the commandment of telling the story of the exodus on the
night of the seder, and, indeed, they are the backbone of the bulk of
the haggada. Each verse is first recited whole, and then is broken down
into pieces, and some comment is made on each "piece" with the aim of
shedding light on the deeper meaning of the verse. This continues until
we get to the piyyut "dayenu", in which we thank G-d for all that G-d
did to us in bringing us out of Egypt (each individual thing G-d did
would have been enough for us to thank G-d, how much more so all the
things G-d did together), including bringing us to the land of Israel
and building the Temple.
The fifth verse said by the bringer of the first fruits is "And you
brought us to this place, and you gave us this land, flowing with milk
and honey." This was left out of the haggada, even though the Mishna
and the Rambam both say one should read the declaration, of the one who
brings his first fruits, to its conclusion. Apparently it was too
painful to say "and you brought us to this place" etc in the darkness of
exile; besides, perhaps, the author of the haggada did not want to
encourage people to think that the land of exile in which they found
themselves was "the promised land".
In any event, since we Jewish people are now privileged to be coming
home to Israel, for about ten years my family has been adding the fifth
verse in the appropriate place in the haggada, together with several
comments on its parts.
This year my family and I have had that addition printed in color with
an attractive design and distributed, last Friday, with explanation, all
around Israel, so that others could enjoy this addition to their seder.
It is also scheduled to appear this week in Bar-Ilan University's "daf
shevui" and on its internet site. Many people have told me that there
were not enough copies of this addition in their synagogue, and they
were unable to receive a copy. So I am adding this method of
distributing it free to whoever may be interested in enriching their
seder experience in this way. I will send one or both of two PDF files,
one black and white and the other in in color, which you or your family
and friends may print out in whatever number you need to use at your
seder. Please send this letter to your family and friends in Israel.
Obviously this addition is not for use outside of Israel.
To receive the files for printing at home, you can send an e-mail to
<djm765@...>, with the word haggada in the subject line, and you
will receive an automatic response with the black and white file
attached; if you want the color file, send an e-mail to the above
address with the word color in the subject line, and you will receive
the color file by automatic response.
If you do not have a PDF file reader, for reading and printing the
attached files, you can download one free at
http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html
Best wishes to all of Israel, for a happy and kosher Pesach!
Rabbi Dr. David Mescheloff
Moshav Hemed
50295 Israel
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From: <bdcohen@...> (David I. Cohen)
Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 12:12:51 -0400
Subject: Developing Halacha
Bernard R. wrote:
>"The question, then, is this: Did no orthodox Jew sign an organ donor
>card in advance of R. Moshe Feinstein's ruling? Or did they act without
>even suspecting that it might be controversial? And did they weigh the
>arguments of those poskim who continue to oppose brain death as a
>definition of death? Two more examples of many out there:
> * The first Jews who bought a refrigerator were certainly unaware that
>opening its door on Shabbat might be forbidden, since it could cause
>the motor to come on. Was there a heter in place to allow it? Of course
>not. When the issue was raised, did anyone stop using the refrigerator
>on Shabbat? I seriusly doubt it: what choice was there? Eventually,
>the heterim followed."
It is hard to prove or disprove this jaundiced view of the halachic
process with out some actual specific proofs rather than specualtion.
But the underlying assumption, i.e. that halachically committed Jews go
ahead willy nilly and do what they want even when halavhic problems
surface and hope that the psak will "catch up" with theri practice, is,
IMHO, a libel on much of our community.
To take the refrigerator issue as an example, it could certainly be true
that the first users of the refrigerator on Shabbat did not perceive a
halachic issue, but that is a far cry from stating that once the issue
surfaced, that same observant person would ignore the issue no matter
what psak eventually came out. And, further, positing that the poskim
would permit its use because if they did not, they would be ignored,
denigrates our poskim, and our community, with no proof.
While it is certainly meritorious for a posek to find a heter
(permission) for an activity if it can be done, that in no way implies
that our Poskim are agenda driven in their decisions.
New technology brings new halachic issues. New societal situations
likewise does. When I grew up, we did not have twist open replaceable
soda bottle caps, so the issue of their use on Shabbat never came
up. When these new fangled tops began to appear on our grocery store
shelves, we bought them. Someone eventually said, "hey, this may be a
problem on Shabbat". If you are saying that poskim determined that since
everyone uses them, lets allow it, that's just wrong. (Whatever the
problem, it would have been easily solved by telling everyone to open
their soda bottles before Shabbat.) I haven't yet found a posek who will
let me tear sheets off my roll of paper towels on Shabbat. Would be nice
though....
David I. Cohen
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From: <bdcohen@...> (David I. Cohen)
Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2005 14:47:04 -0400
Subject: Developing Halacha
Bernard R. wrote:
>"However, when "casual" travel to Israel became possible in the jet
>airplane era some 50 years ago, and this practice came into increasing
>question, I suppose the existence of that earlier opinion of the
>Chacham Tsvi gave impetus and validation to the desire for change
>(although it took about 30-40 years of frequent-flyer miles to
>percolate). And yes, the observance of 2 days of yomtov for chutzniks
>was very well-established, and still is, I believe, in many quarters,
>although I believe that the pace of change in this practice in the last
>10 years has been nothing less than astonishing."
Again, there is a lot of supposition and speculation without any facts
to back it up. The issue of how many days of Yom Tov for a chutznik to
observe in Israel (or vica versa) has been the subject of many diverse
halachic opinions and continues to be so today., despite the ease of
travel. So, where is this so-called "pace of change"? What has changed?
Are more poskim now changing their opinions? For example, are the
student of Rav Soleveitchik no longer holding his so-called "day and a
half" rule? If your empirical evidence is that people are ignoringthe
psak of theri posek, the the issue is better framed: why are so-called
observant Jews not following their posek? IOW, the fault is in the
community. But to say that the poskim bend to the prevauiling
wind....that's a huge (and IMHO unfounded) accusation.
David I. Cohen
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From: David Eisen <davide@...>
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 14:24:21 +0200
Subject: RE: Quinoa for Pesach
I have the same question as Ms. Aliza Berger (I asked an Israeli poseq
this very question last night, and he told me that he did not have
sufficient knowledge and suggested I contact an American poseq) and
would just like to add that even if it is considered acceptable for
consumption by Ashkenazim, does it nonetheless require a hechsher, or
can one simply check the quinoa prior to Pesah to ensure that it indeed
does not contain any hametz or kitniot?
B'virkat Hag Kasher v'Sameah,
David Eisen
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From: Aliza Berger <alizadov@...>
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 14:35:39 +0200
Subject: RE: Quinoa for Pesach
Interesting. My mother-in-law is in Canada, and the posek I heard the
negative from is here in Israel. But quinoa is easily available here, so
I think an Israeli rabbi should be able to be knowledgeable about it.
Sincerely, Aliza
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From: Warren Burstein <warren@...>
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 14:55:52 +0300
Subject: Quinoa for Pesach
http://www.star-k.org/kashrus/kk-passover-quinoa.htm says
Kosher for Passover Status: Quinoa was determined to be Kosher L'Pesach
in the summer of 1996, when Rabbi Aaron Tendler, of Yeshivas Ner Israel,
brought a box of quinoa to Rabbi Blau, Dayan of the Eidah Hachareidus in
Israel. Rabbi Blau consulted with professors at the Vulcan Institute and
ruled quinoa to be Kosher L'Pesach. Rabbi Blau told Rabbi Tendler that
quinoa is not related to the, five types of grain, nor to millet or
rice. It is, according to the Towson Library Reference Desk, a member
of the "goose foot" family, which includes sugar beets and beet root. It
does not grow in the vicinity of chameishes minei dagan-five types of
grain products. Consumers are urged to carefully check grains before
Pesach for extraneous matter.
[Same web reference sent in by
Bruce Abrams <bruce_abrams@...>
"Hosseinof, Joshua (Exchange)" <JHosseinof@...>
Mod]
[Addendum from Warren in second message]
I found a previous version of the same message from the Star K website
on my disk, it used to also contain this sentence "As with other Pesach
products, quinoa should not be purchased from open bins, but rather in
sealed packages." in place of the current "Consumers are urged to
carefully check grains before Pesach for extraneous matter.".
People should of course ask their own rabbi, but I understood that to
mean that instead of searching for a bag marked "kosher for Passover"
(which I don't think you will find), buy a bag before Pesach (and
according to the new version, check it before Pesach starts to remove
anything that isn't quinoa).
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From: Avi Frydman <frydman@...>
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 14:52:16 GMT
Subject: Quinoa for Pesach
The following is from the Star-K website and was printed in their
Kashruth Kurrents newsletter 7-8 years ago.:
Quinoa: The Grain That's Not
Sara-Malka Laderman, Jacob's Ladder Farm
Tired of potatoes, potatoes, potatoes for Pesach? Try quinoa
("Keen-Wa"), a sesame-seed-sized kernel first brought to the United
States from Chile nineteen years ago, according to Rebecca Theurer
Wood. Quinoa has been cultivated in the Andes Mountains for thousands of
years, growing three to six feet tall despite high altitudes, intense
heat, freezing temperatures, and as little as four inches of annual
rainfall. Peru and Bolivia maintain seed banks with 1,800 types of
quinoa.
Quinoa was first grown outside of South America fifteen years ago, says
Wood: Steve Gorad and Don McKinley, wishing to market quinoa in the
United States, had commissioned a farmer to see if quinoa would grow in
the Colorado Rockies. It did.
Seeds range in color from pink and orange to blue-black, purple, and
red. However, once their natural saponin coating is washed off, the
seeds are pale yellow.
Kosher for Passover Status: Quinoa was determined to be Kosher L'Pesach
in the summer of 1996, when Rabbi Aaron Tendler, of Yeshivas Ner Israel,
brought a box of quinoa to Rabbi Blau, Dayan of the Eidah Hachareidus in
Israel. Rabbi Blau consulted with professors at the Vulcan Institute and
ruled quinoa to be Kosher L'Pesach. Rabbi Blau told Rabbi Tendler that
quinoa is not related to the, five types of grain, nor to millet or
rice. It is, according to the Towson Library Reference Desk, a member of
the "goose foot" family, which includes sugar beets and beet root. It
does not grow in the vicinity of chameishes minei dagan-five types of
grain products. Consumers are urged to carefully check grains before
Pesach for extraneous matter.
Quinoa Preparation: To avoid burning the delicate kernels, pour the
quinoa into boiling water (twice as much water as quinoa), turn off the
flame, and cover the pot. The quinoa will continue to cook itself, is
ready in ten minutes or less, and can be served like rice. Quinoa is a
translucent dish with more calcium, iron, and protein than wheat, and is
gluten free.
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From: Michael Mirsky <mirskym@...>
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 11:53:51 -0400
Subject: Quinoa for Pesach
I asked our LOR this question last year. He said that this has been
investigated, and quinoa wasn't known at the time the various species which
are considered kitniot were determined. So they are not kitniot.
Michael Mirsky
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From: Martin Stern <md.stern@...>
Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2005 20:29:14 +0100
Subject: Re: Quinoa for Pesach
Quinoa would appear to be a type of grain which would be considered
kitniot since it can be ground into a flour from which one can produce
baked items. The point at issue is whether something unknown at the
time the custom was adopted is included. In some communities peanuts
were eaten on Pesach because of this.
Martin Stern
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End of Volume 47 Issue 68
